What a waste of time

Discussion in 'Renaissance Discussion' started by WoblinTheGoblin, Mar 2, 2017.

  1. Pirul

    Pirul Well-Known Member
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    VERY important to mention, camping rares and gathering rares, are two VERY different things. One is AFK gumped and the other is not. Camping rares afk, which only provides a "cruicial part" of gathering them (wealth) is 100% legal, while the actual action of gathering them afk, which actually represents a material gain, is not, and thus is gumped. I am unaware if people actually do this in this shard, but it would be a VERY simple way to gain plat...and a timer.

    As for how efficient IDERP would be if a change was made, only their pixel-greed would dictate if they're willing to put in marginally more time or not. My guess is as good as yours.

    Mine: their pixel-greed is large enough that they'd each take 5 minute breaks from their job every 90-180 minutes to switch screens and run the bot attended, and between 4 of them keep the timers close enough for them to continue to dominate (btw, this is how the rares group did it in UOSA, and it wasn't really hard). Or just have the bot running in a secondary screen while working. And I doubt it'd be too hard to recruit a pixel-greedy Euro to help them cover that time.
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  2. WoblinTheGoblin

    WoblinTheGoblin Member

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    Am I missing something? Wouldn't randomizing the IDOC process eliminate the possibility of bots being successful? Once that house goes IDOC, the person watching the screen has the advantage.
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  3. Chris

    Chris Renaissance Staff
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    While this is an unfortunate situation for a new player to experience house decays are one of the most felucca experiences on a free server. On my last server I started out the same. Was excited to find decays, frustrated when the established group of pvp'ers wiped me the first few times. But I learned about the process. I made friends. I macro'ed up some stealthers. I started keeping a mage in town to pickup dead stealthers to send right back to give murder counts. After time the same people who were killing me, learned to respect me. I formed my own group of players. One player specifically killed my stealthers over 250 times in one month. A year later we ended up being good friends. Later still our group went on to become the group that everyone disliked for being good at "decays". The UO Circle of life.

    Someone on a previous server once said playing Ultima Online meant you had to be immune to discouragement. And to a degree that is true. We do what we can here to slowly introduce our players to the world and its rules. But the world is harsh, challenging and sometimes frustrating. But that is what makes UO great.

    There are no limits to how far you can go in this game. Just don't let a situation in which you came out on the losing side, define you existence as a UOR player. Don't blame the other players that were there. Don't fall for the classic they were better than me, so they must be cheaters excuse. Learn from the situation. Talk to other players, learn how to time houses, never camp a house decay without a timer. And best of all make some friends who share a common goal.

    Any desirable house that decays on this server will be subject to conflict, and the more desirable the house, the more intense the conflict. Maybe now is not the time to camp house decays, but if you find joy in this area. With some time and effort you can be successful as well. We hope you stick it out here and realize how much fun UO can be. And how much that fun is amplified by remembering the times that you didn't do so well, compared to the player you can become in the future.

    Any time you change the world to punish the hard work of other players, you are destroying the experience for everyone. Once you go down that path, you set a precedent for changing every system into a socialist one. Effort, Teamwork, Planning and Mastering of the Ultima Online world should be celebrated. Never punished. This is our global mentality in relation to the development of UO Renaissance.

    Many many servers try the "just randomize _____, to punish the players that are good at it" method of development. And it never ends well or has to desired result. Most of the time the change is quietly rolled back with little fanfair as the system they aimed to fix is now broken for all players.
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  4. BlackEye

    BlackEye Well-Known Member
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    You might be right @Pirul. But they would have to boost their numbers, or invest more time somehow. And they would be attended ingame. Other players would have to deal with them face to face (well, you know what I mean).

    The randomization of IDOCs is another topic that was talked in this thread about, too. Yeah, well, it certainly would lead to more camping hours in front of the screen. Or more people would have the chance to get loot by sheer luck.
    But I am not sure, if I would like it. I can understand, that it should be profitable for people when they are doing stuff sophisticated (get the timers). Making it really random, increases the chances for everyone, but you destroy this "invest much time and have high skill to gain much" approach. I find the lottery gamble idea by the way annoying during the server annivesaries. Dyes and sandals that fetch 10mil+ are given out randomly and players that havent achieved anything except logging in become wealthy just by luck while others have to play weeks for that wealth. It would be the same case with IDOCs. Well roughly, Forts and Keeps would probably be perma camped. By the way, european players would profit the most from randomization and I still oppose it.
  5. Pirul

    Pirul Well-Known Member
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    Forgot to reply to this, but my opinion is that, you surprised them. They were not ready to adapt/change to a random element of surprise which they kind of knew would not last. As for a change in how things work permanently? A permanent solution to counter that change.
    It might. And I don't oppose it either. From my first serious post in this thread:
    Again, just my opinion. I may be wrong, but I do belive this is something they would 100% do.
  6. Pirul

    Pirul Well-Known Member
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    This is my sentiment exactly! People see the bots and think: "Oh, this takes no effort!", "They're playing easy-mode", "They're cheating". In reality, since they have never actually been part of the group, they don't know the amount of work it took to get to the "botting" stage. People seem to neglect the number of house signs actually clicked to get to this stage. But that is not seen, so...
  7. wylwrk

    wylwrk Well-Known Member

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    I will never pardon anyone that clamors for change without attempting proficiency of the current process.

    management 101
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  8. WoblinTheGoblin

    WoblinTheGoblin Member

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    @Chris Okay, I will come back! I appreciate you taking the time to address my concerns. I still don't think randomizing IDOCs will generate a socialist paradise and I'm curious to hear more about the failed attempts. That being said, I am going to start confronting this challenge. There is a lot to be said about a game I played in the 90s and still beckons me to this day. I apologize for the way I phrased my first comments and the title of this thread. Looking back, I would've given much more appropriate considerations. Thanks to everyone who told me to stay, and to the people who called me a cry baby or flung salty trolls my way, I'll see you on the battlefield (Not yet though because I'm still pretty much a noob. But just you wait!!!)!
  9. wylwrk

    wylwrk Well-Known Member

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    I'm so happy to see ^ that post.

    good on ya m8... good on ya
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  10. Pirul

    Pirul Well-Known Member
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    Very glad you're staying! Stick it to the man!!
  11. OptimisticSam

    OptimisticSam Well-Known Member
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    Good on you! Get at it, and best of luck. Let me know if I can help with anything in-game (Gestas on IRC and in game).
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  12. Chris

    Chris Renaissance Staff
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    I am glad to hear that, As a former player and staff on UO Renaissance we can always understand the frustration a player has in a situation like this. We have made great strides towards fairness in our systems over the years. And with the AFK system you have an equal chance to take part in any part of the UO experience without fear that players are using unfair tactics to get ahead.
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  13. Larloch

    Larloch Well-Known Member

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  14. One

    One Well-Known Member
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    .
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2023
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  15. One

    One Well-Known Member
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    Last edited: Feb 5, 2023
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  16. Blaise

    Blaise Well-Known Member
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    Staring at a screen is not effort. At all. You can literally post up a secondary display while you watch Netflix.
  17. snap dragon

    snap dragon Well-Known Member

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    Question:

    Why is their afk check on house signs normally, but not with item-id? Intended or a bug? Curious, I don't idoc and really could care less.
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  18. Pirul

    Pirul Well-Known Member
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    You cannot "click" with razor, but you can with 3rd party programs. If you're "clicking" on a sign while afk, then you just gave away that you are in fact using an illegal 3rd party program.
  19. Chris

    Chris Renaissance Staff
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    I just wanted to comment very clearly, that the screenshots that were posted by Erlkonig is not a system that will function with our AFK protections here. A player trying to use this system would be caught and banned immediately. Why he choose to post those pictures is a question we will discuss. But we will not tolerate fear-mongering about suspected cheating by the logic of it happening elsewhere. That program is paired with EUO/UOS scripts that auto run the world clicking on house signs to build a text file, that is imported into a companion application. It is very common on other servers without systems that you find on UO Renaissance. And is usually the reason that they end up nerfing house decays into some random mess to combat programs like that.

    But to be exceptionally clear, that does not work on UO Renaissance. And someone trying to track houses this way (a rail as it is called) would be caught immediately.

    Note: The second screenshot seems to indicate that the program is able to determine the owner of a house. This is not information that is accessible to anyone other than the friend of a house and would not be able to be obtained by any method.
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  20. CaptainMorgan

    CaptainMorgan Well-Known Member
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    This. Item ID on house signs should have AFK check
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