Murder count system is not era-accurate and needs to be fixed

Discussion in 'Era Discussion' started by Leopold, Mar 30, 2020.

  1. Leopold

    Leopold Well-Known Member
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    The default RunUO murder system is not era accurate. It does not give the correct messages for "I must consider my sins." This is how it should be:

    No short or long-term counts: "Fear not, thou hast not slain the innocent."
    No short term counts, but at least 1 long-term count: "Fear not, thou hast not slain the innocent in some time..."
    Less than 5 short term counts: "Although thou hast slain the innocent, thy deeds shall not bring retribution upon thy return to the living."
    5 or more short term counts (statloss): "If thou should return to the land of the living, the innocent shall wreak havoc upon thy soul."
    Perma-red "Thou art known throughout the lands as a murderous brigand!" [red if in stat, blue if not]

    Proposed changes:
    1. Add the above messages;
    2. Don't give the exact numbers of counts, only give messages;
    3. Enable perma-red (i.e. so-called ping-pong counter. If you go from blue to red and back to blue 5x, your character can never go blue again);
    4. Perma-red characters can still be deleted because they are subject to the same restrictions for # of murder counts that exist right now.

    Evidence:
    https://web.archive.org/web/20000304131248/http://update.uo.com/design_32.html
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2020
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  2. Chris

    Chris Renaissance Staff
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    1. We don't mind the era accurate messages, most of the system we have currently was hand built to match the era. Players could still see their precise count on the website if they have their profile public.

    2. This is reasonable, as for most things we prefer Richard Garriots original vision of a fantasy game opposite of D&D. A broadsword of vanquishing vs a +9 Broadsword.

    3. This has been planned for a long time, just a bit complex to add without adding an additional integer to all 125k playermobiles. An efficient method needs to be determined to not impact save times. (adding PlayerMobile * 1 Small Integer). Probably not a significant increase but I am allergic to adding serialized that for only 2% of a collection.

    4. This would probably be fine, however the logic for disallowing deletion of a character as it provides a method to absolve yourself of those murder counts and start a new character. If a player wants to use a character slot for wanton murder then there should be a penalty for that. However the restriction primarily applies to minimal skill characters that were created just to kill other players and then be deleted. We allow deletion on a case by case basis for developed characters with extensive long term counts.

    Note: Keep in mind the system we have now was not default in RunUO. It was developed from research regarding how murderers worked, stratics research, patch note review and a re-creation of the bounty system based on available pictures of the gumps from that era.

    The current UOR Guide for the system
    http://uorforum.com/threads/the-renaissance-murder-system.1450
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  3. One

    One Well-Known Member
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    Last edited: Feb 2, 2023
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  4. Chris

    Chris Renaissance Staff
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    That's why the deletion is a subjective process. Plenty of players have asked for and been allowed to delete the character.
  5. One

    One Well-Known Member
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    Last edited: Feb 2, 2023
  6. Unknown_Hero

    Unknown_Hero Active Member

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    Reds already have it hard enough being that a long term takes 2 days to burn and stat sucks.
  7. One

    One Well-Known Member
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    Last edited: Feb 2, 2023
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  8. Leopold

    Leopold Well-Known Member
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    I do have my own opinions on how "hard" it is for reds here (or for players who are PKd), but my goal in posting this was mainly to make UOR slightly more like the UO we remember, while considering whether the changes could ruin someone else's gaming or harm the shard in some way via unintended consequences, and not to punish reds. But keep in mind the following in mind:

    1. You can have 3 free accounts here. Sure, maybe people paid for multiple accounts on OSI, but in my experience that wasn't the norm. This provides many benefits to allow you do do thinks to protect/rescue yourself, burn counts on 3 accounts at the same time, etc.
    2. You can have up to 7 toons per account. So a total of 21 toons rather than 5.
    3. The server does not automatically log you out, and you can legally burn counts 24/7 on each account.
    4. We don't have ridiculous skill gain rules like OSI had. We don't have 8x8, AFK macroing is allowed, resist parties make GM resist realistically possible, etc.
    5. Gold is relatively easy to farm here (less competition for farming spots, bonded pets, multiple accounts, etc.).
    6. Razor is way more advanced than UOAssist was back in 1999-2001 at least (when I played). There is also ClassicUO, UOAM/ClassicUO map, mature voice chat applications. These provide innumerable advantages to all players that were either not available or not widely used in-era.
    7. The community here is willing to help out players who ask for help with rescues, getting started, and many PKs will even help their victims recover.
    8. We are on a much more level playing-field when it comes to internet connections today. Some players may have higher pings, but gone are the days when one player with a fast connection can mow down everyone on dial-up.
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  9. Chris

    Chris Renaissance Staff
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    Now that we have the ability for players to expand their character slots, we will most likely adapt that policy accordingly. In most cases it is a player returning from a long break, with no desire to play their PK character and just wanting to have a new start but lacks a character to delete for it. The red character tends to be the first choice to delete.

    And to be clear the deletion rule exists because people were creating a character, waiting 7 days, and then going on a town killing spree and then deleting the character immediately.
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  10. One

    One Well-Known Member
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    Last edited: Feb 2, 2023
  11. Unknown_Hero

    Unknown_Hero Active Member

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    On UOG they had a blue ball of forgiveness which erased all counts, how about something similar with copper or plat?
  12. Earsnot

    Earsnot Well-Known Member
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    Tell me more of your blue balls....

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