Stratics from Jun/2000 and Oct/2000 both confirm that NPCs should sell arrows @ 3gp but, on this shard, NPCs charge 8 gp. Why does a single arrow cost more than a Flamestrike? Is this only in Occlo? I dunno.
Because if we're going to have terrible archery skill calculations we may as well add insult to injury with overpriced pointed sticks. I wylwrk.
May I ask what these "terrible skill calculations" are? Bearing in mind that my provo-archer is brand-new, "young", with only 40ish shown Archery and only very-high-20s Tactics, I just spent 30 mins in Occlo Sewers: going in with 120 arrows (960gp), I came out with ... 17 arrows, some leather, and ... (wait for it!) ... 343 gp, and the giant toads and Ratmen did all the "heavy-lifting"! I am ... disappointed: it may be that this shard isn't cut-out for me. Are there any other significant deviations in the operations of the game, in the pursuit of "History Perfected", of which I might want to be aware? I dunno.
My guess is that arrow prices were boosted on NPC vendors here to encourage players to build them via fletching. If they were to cost 3g each from vendors, no one would bother making arrows themselves. But agreed, the end result is archery gets another stick in the eye. Archery is definitely not a noob-friendly skill at these costs. Really, at any cost, it's not a noob-friendly skill. I Basoosh.
I won't sugar coat it. I will point out that I'm very opinionated. Playing/creating a character to maximize profit. Playing/creating a character to maximize fun. Playing/creating a character to maximize profit AND fun. *queue sad piano music* Look... Those are imo three entirely different subjects and to open them for discussion could lead to a very long opinionated thread fraught with debate. However, if you're waxing nostalgic for some good ol' UO times this is it! You're here! You've made it... you just have to put some effort in to find your own personal way just like the rest of us. You won't always win. Every step won't always be the right one. It's the same for all of us. We're all plopped into this world with an equal opportunity. I'll summarize with this. There's fun to be had here. Tons of it. How to go about it is purely up to you man... it's always been... *dramatic pause* ... up to you. *cheesy record scratch* Actually, forget all that. Make a tamer. Win at everything. I wylwrk
Well, 8gp arrows & bolts is not the 'solution' I would have implemented: 3 shafts/log is the direction in which I would have gone, were I narcissistic-enough to feel that this was something that OSI had 'botched' and, hence, needed correction; I don't see any reference to any "fletcher's toolkits", either, in the Renaissance-era Stratics references ... Archery was (and, in my opinion could be and should be) an accessible alternative to Magery to provide for ranged attacks, particularly as the primary weapon of any Bard (does no one but myself and Richard Garriott remember that Iolo FitzOwen, companion to The Avatar, had been both archer and bard?): 8gp an arrow sure rules out accessibility ... I first had misgivings when I arrived here 4 days ago, and found that my character had been created with 1000 gp ... Seriously? 1000gp starter money? Gee, are there economic problems here? I can't imagine why ... Yesterday, I was amazed to see that GM armour here is apparently better than Guarding, and almost as good as Hardening, with only base materials: with rare materials, even better than that; only minutes later, I was reading about how Wrestling-damage had to be adjusted, because (presumably) "too much" damage was being absorbed by armour ... The Devil, you say! How on all Sosaria could that have happened !?! This shard is not cut-out for me, I guess. My dissatisfaction must be categorized as a complete lack of faith in the sensibilities, capabilities, and intentions of the administrators of this shard: fix identified bugs, sure, make boats player-craftable-only, sounds interesting, introduce content from later eras, why not?, but apply senseless and arbitrary changes to the ruleset, and there can be no trust, and no confidence in the "vision" of this shard. Wow, my very first thread, very-well received, will also be my last. I am disappointed even further: I had really wanted to live in two-story stone tower ... I dunno.
Note that if you make your own arrows, you can essentially make them for 5gp per. (market price for boards is 3gp per, and feathers are 2gp per) But very much agreed, I like your suggestion. Archery needs to be much more accessible and less costly than it is now for newer players. I would go even further than what you suggested and make the crafting formula this: 1 log + 1 feather = 3 arrows And then the NPC price could be reduced to 3gp per, as well. This would do wonders for making archery more noob-friendly, while still providing some cost incentive to use fletching and make your own. Archery itself could probably also use a boost of some type for end-game situations, but that is a different topic. I know you're being sarcastic here, but I honestly can't tell if you're saying 1000gp is too much or too little? I think it's just fine. It's enough to train a few secondary skills up to mid-30s levels, some starter equipment, and a small bag of regs or bandages. Any less than 1000gp, and starting out can be too unforgiving. It's definitely not having any impact on shard economy, if that's what you were thinking. GM armor is pretty solid stuff, but... shouldn't it be? Often times in MMOs, equipment gained from crafting gets completely obliterated by end-game equipment grinds, to the point that there is no reason to even bother with crafting. I think GM armor here is overall in a pretty good place. It's worthwhile to be a tailor. It's worthwhile to wear GM armor. If you want better, you can certainly choose to wear better, but it won't be as cost effective. GM weapons, on the other hand, fall short of that mark. Lesser runics have basically occupied that role, so it's basically a non-issue, except when it comes to archery (yea, it's kind of the red-headed stepchild of UOR). To be fair, archery runics are slated to be introduced in the next content patch. From what I remember, the wrestling adjustment was because interrupts and the application of special attacks (such as stun-punches) do not happen when zero damage is dealt in RunUO. This change basically allowed players to use stun-punches without also needing Tactics in their template, which would be a pretty big buzzkill for mage type characters. I think it was overall a good compromise. Armor remains useful while simultaneously not shutting off access to certain PvP templates. Good luck with your search for a shard. I will tell you that if you can get past archery not being cost-effective on noob characters, UOR is a pretty great shard and easily the best I've found. No "pay-to-win" already places it head and shoulders over 90% of alternatives. Add in extremely committed staff and a remarkably friendly community (especially for Felucca), and you'll be hard pressed to find better. I Basoosh.
I agree with you on Archery and I think quite a few people here would. Perhaps if the legendary Triple Crossbow was invented on this shard, archery could get a good boost Starting money has absolutely zero bearing on the shard's economy, none whatsoever. If anything, it gives people enough of a boost to buy what they need before they can make new gold and actually STAY here, unlike other shards where you only start out with 100 or 250 g and pray you can somehow get a few more coins from attempting to kill a skeleton using 50tac 50 sword setup... IF you don't get pk'd 5 seconds in, teabagged, and told to "get good or leave". The vision of the shard is just fine, but as with anything you can't be everything to everyone and someone will always complain. Coincidentally, sometimes there are complainers that pop up and make similar post bemoaning this or that, and revealed by staff research to have spent no time in the game whatsover.
There is at least one player vendor, that I know of, who sells bulk arrows for less than NPC price. It might be worthwhile for you to leave Ocllo, but then again, I think everybody should leave that place. If the people are so desperate for cheaper arrows, take up fletching and sell them for 5gp an arrow or something and strike it big! I amnotplayingthisgame.
Anyone wanna play guess who his/her main forum account is? The archery as well as all melee weapon issues have been brought up directly to and acknowledged by this server's creator and staff. There is absolutely no reason to further outline or prove the point otherwise. Again, for emphasis... this has been done. We're talking about threads that are years old people... years. So, what does lack of any action what-so-ever on any of these issues lead you to believe? Shut up, be a tamer is what it told me. I have an archer too. He's a lot of fun. I hunt harpies, get feathers, make arrows. Shoot, sometimes I go off the deep end and light a campfire to cook a lil snack with. Shit, I might even say thee and thou while I'm at it. My arrows don't have to be balanced with magery. If I want something that's balanced with magery, I'll use magery. As for you, I dunno... , this server is being ran by one person for free. He could pull the plug (why he hasn't yet is beyond me) at any moment and be justified in doing so. We're all volunteers here. When you planned all this or did you actually fantasize in your head that Chris would see this "new player" (yeah right) thread and that would finally grab his attention after all this time, an orchestra would start playing, a golden beam of light would bolt from his fingers as he feverishly banged out all the code you ever dreamed of... all just for you? I do know
I should clear up a couple of things, I guess. According to an order of importance of my own devising, 1. I don't need to find a(nother) shard: I'm well-established on a different shard that follows a strict, but non-UOR, ruleset. I was specifically looking for a 'vacation' shard, in which a Lumberjack axe-fighter could live in a 2-storey stone tower, from which I might (eventually) explore the expanded/revised bard skillset (disco, targeted peace, difficulty-based effects); there are other tidbits in the UOR ruleset which I had/have a desire to explore. 2. With the above in mind, my remarks about 1000gp were indeed sarcastic, but in the direction of 10x the money required for anyone, possessing sense, ambition and patience, to get started in UO. Gee, it's not like you can't have 3 accounts here, all running Razor-macros when you aren't actively playing ... I don't wish to offend Basoosh, who is being kind and (I am sure) honest, but I don't believe that there are no problems with the economy: I see "young" players on horses razor-macro-Flamestriking themselves at Occlo bank ... 3. wylwrk suggests that I am someone's "smurf": I am not; I do invite any member of the administration to confirm that this IP is not associated with any pre-existing forum or game-playing accounts, and that the same IP is attached to 3 game-playing accounts, all created in the last week. wylwrk's remarks, otherwise, tell me that there does exist some (perhaps small) amount of fractious unrest within the community, regarding the shard's approach to "fulfilling its vision". I'll interject that, when one discards the ruleset, one can naturally expect results that are, ahem, unruly. 4. wylwrk makes other suggestions, entirely out of his own head, speculating upon my fantasies: masturbate elsewhere, please and, kindly, leave me out of it. And, no, you don't know: I had to tell you, just now. 5. Triple-Crossbows!!! U7 FTW! If there were any non-game-breaking way to have functioning 3Xbows, I would love it ("um, you there, stand behind me" ...)! 6. For Paddy, on OSI, one account, first character, 1997-2000 (and likely later): 50 Lumberjack, 49 Bowcraft, 1 Carpentry, 100gp: 2.5+K in the bank in one hour, never leaving a Guard Zone, no Razor. Oh, but that's work. Well, gee, it's too bad if something worthwhile actually demands any investment ... Otherwise, I have indeed played here a little (and "a little" has become "enough"): 3 characters, individually 30-90 mins in Occlo sewer and/or buying/selling/gathering/crafting, otherwise afk-macroing skills/stats non-stop: I know that NPCs charge 8gp/pc for arrows/bolts, that chopping a tree invokes the skill-delay-timer (at least it does with the Hiding skill, and a Counsellor told me that was intended), and that crafters here can make AR43 plate and AR31 leather armour. 7. I posted here, my first and only post, because I am new and wanted confirmation that "I am indeed seeing here what I am seeing". That has been confirmed. I am a trifle disappointed after my initial hopes and time-invested, but sanguine that I have found this out early: this shard is not cut-out for me. Anyone who has fun here, carry on. So, whenever I get around to it, I'll poke around and see if I can find a UOR-dedicated shard that is a little less-loose when it comes to modifying the ruleset. The "trust/confidence" issue that I plead is anchored to one thing: I came to this shard to play UO(R), and UO(R) isn't here; so I won't be. A lot of you folks seem nice, too. Good luck, have fun. Will I succeed in finding my 'vacation' shard? I dunno.
Archery just needs a flat accuracy curve and a removal of penalties for shooting while moving. No damage or cost adjustments required.
Arrows and bolts could stand to be cheaper. Bring it up directly to Telamon in a private message on irc. Be reasonable and not demanding or rude. He will be considerate in my opinion. I don't know why this thread turned out this way, but there is no reason to leave the server and this is a perfectly reasonable request.
lol, shard advertises "Felluca" and "history perfected", then you guys are total dicks when someone is surprised/shocked by some of the things that are completely different from how the game "Ultima Online" actually was. OP, archery sucks, it absolutely will not compete against a mage. There's also trammel instanced shit that was never in the Ultima Online during this era, warriors are nerfed in general, it's definitely a pro mage and pro tamer shard, and the majority of this community loves that and will defend it to the end. I wouldn't let anyone here bother you for your opinions, again they're playing tamers...
i don't play a tamer, and this shard is only pro-magery to the extent that dexxers and archery is weak as heck. I have some propositions on how both could be improved. edit: here is a suggestion: iron armors have increased AC and grant passive magic resistance. also archery is never a solo combat skill even in OSI, and must be paired with magery or barding to be useful in either PvM or PvP.
