Pub 16 Armors with no Powerscrolls makes dexers underwhelming

The Pub 16 armor types were introduced in conjunction with powerscrolls to give extra protection to scale with the increase in skills. Since there are no Powerscrolls here this severely unbalances pvp in favor of mages over dexers. Lowering spell damage,armor rating or increasing weapon damage would help balance this.

Just like you wouldn't be able to kill a skillful mage 1v1 on OSI during publish 16 without having power scrolls, it's almost impossible to do here as well because you are dealing considerably less damage overall. You are more likely to land minimal damage hits and even less likelier to land higher damage range hits. Most people enjoy the new armor types but not powerscrolls but the consequences of adding one without the other imbalances pvp and throws off all weapon damage spreads. You rarely see dexers pvping because it's expensive, less rewarding and overall riskier to play and the increased armor rating throws off all weapon damage spreads so there is never any consistency.

This is a great shard that seems to value an authentic UOR experience so hopefully some tweaks can be made to address this, thanks for reading.

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Thanks for the response. I think the easiest fix would be to give all dexers +20 magic resist. That would be on par with the advantage casters have over dexers right now, but since that would be impossible to do I think the next best thing would be to increase the damage of all weapons to deal the correct damage they should.

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I feel simply removing the bonus ar would be enough.

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It is possible to take down a mage with a dexxer 1v1, just gotta be carrying higher end weapons like power or vanq. Since I was running low on gear a few nights ago I went out with a warfork of freaking might just for shits and giggles, and held my own against one of the more notoriuos pk's on this shard and fought to a draw. I'm no pvp genius but someone who could utilize exp potions in conjunction with para blows can take down a mage if they stick to them and interrupt spellcasts. But still, like many have said before, to run a successful dexxer you need more expensive equipment rather than the standard leather, regs, and potions a mage would carry.

With that being said, I would like to see at the very least some sort of ability for higher end armors to resist a small percentage of spell damage since armor is still a physical barrier and should offer some protection in addition to normal resist. Or even give parry a pvp use in offering a percentage of spell resist on top of regular magic resist for a special move with shields.

Here's the way non-dexxers (and probably rightfully so) look at this from the other side of the table:

While it's expensive to play a dexxer effectively in PvP it's also much easier than effectively playing a mage. Mage PvP ends up being cheaper when you look at it in terms of cost of death but it's much harder to figure out how to kill someone competent in PvP. Timing offensive spells and stuns while also regulating mana and keeping yourself alive is more difficult than that point/click/chase of a dexxer.

I do find dexxers are underwhelming in pvp, however. If I would suggest one thing that would tip the scales slightly is buffing the nox dexxer. Giving the nox dexxer a chance to apply LP would change the outcome of some fights where a simple cure pot won't suffice. I too think swing speed is too slow for the dex sacrifices dexxers have to make in order to avoid mindblast rape.

If they were to actually balance weapon damage properly here, the subsequent whining would reach epic proportions.

Nox dexxers are actually one of the best dexxer templates currently out there. Most others are pretty laughable.

The solution to the armor imbalance of mages having 31 AR and still being able to med, is runic weaponry. I've said it more than once on these forums but the obvious answer, without changing any drastic mechanics, would be to make high end runic hammers as prevalent as high end mask dyes (ie: balance the bods).

I'm not saying every newbie should be rolling valorites but gold GM runic is the new mid-range/decent weapon and GM Valorite is the new vanq, in this hybrid of AR/Weaponry/Med ability/SkillCap.

If valorite weapons were more like 100k a pop, you'd see a lot more capable dexxers in the field. As it stands, waiting for the RNG on a basic vanq/gold to get a mage on the ropes for a purple/wand finisher, is like waiting for paint to dry.

UOR was great because both classes were effective and very deadly. I would argue that it's much easier to keep yourself alive on a Mage here with Reactive Armor, Defensive Wrestling, healing, inscription and also much easier to kill. Landing a stun punch is pretty much a guaranteed kill here that doesn't require much skill, you are also able to play much more aggressive knowing that even Vanq weapons have a good chance of only hitting you for 4 damage here.

Sure you can still kill mages even with the weapon damage being much lower than it was on OSI, but let's be real, Mage's have to be terrible to die here to a dexer 1v1.

It's true, mage's would have to tread more carefully against a experienced well geared dexer, but fixing weapon damage would also create a higher demand for quality weapons so the risk vs reward would be still be hugely in their favor, you're maybe losing a leather suit, pots and regs for a chance at a 100k+ weapon. Worth imo.

That's not necessarily true, I've killed my share of whom are considered very good mages on this server with my two pvp dexxers. In a 1v1 dexxers tend to do well versus mages if the dexxer knows what they are doing (supplementing explo pots, mage heals, and wands, using poison). Dexxers just lack that deep burst damage that a mage can land in 1 combo and finish off with a well placed stun.

I agree that higher tier weapons (even after the last change to weapon damage) are still underwhelming. A vanq axe shouldn't be hitting for 10.

This would be a great point in the thread for this to become a mindblast thread for a page or two. That is of course, if we are trying to emulate the other numerous threads on this subject beginning years ago.

Keyword is considered good here. The handicap on weapon damage here gives every single mage permanent training wheels, they may seem good, but it's not actually that difficult to curse or feeble mind a dexer then follow up with a stunpunch combo, with balanced stats most dexers won't survive a dump unless they are eval and pot buffed. Even if you are half health you can chug, heal through a bigger weapon hit knowing that was their one lucky RNG for the next 10-20 seconds.

That being said weapon damage here is closer to what it was on OSI compared to any other free shard. Poisoning has always been very good, but it was never a necessity and shouldn't be. On other free shards alchemy and poisoning are a necessity because raw weapon damage has been nerfed to useless proportions. When you add up the bonuses you get from modifiers and skills and stats it just makes no sense how you could be hitting for 4-12 damage consistently with a strong Vanq weapon.


http://www.uorenaissance.com/list/Weapon/M This chart is the weapon spread for store bought weapons with no Skill or stat modifiers. You can't even come close to producing these spreads with Vanq weapons and GM skills.

The way I look at Mindblast is yes I can be 2 shotted with a 100 100 build, but at least this problem is avoidable with balanced stats. If weapon damage was where it should be you wouldn't be missing those sacrificed stat points as much and still get to utilize your extra int with magery. You should be able to keep yourself blessed a good amount of the time with balanced stats to make up for it.

It's not really THAT bad. You can be three shotted, if you're not healing at all. Just balancing stats goes a long way and with the Combat Ability cap we have here (custom), moving points out of Strength to bolster your swing speed, bandage speed or mana pool, isn't a bad thing for any dexxer.

However, the recently modified bandage timers absolutely boosted the survival rates of Heal Mages, while doing practically nothing for dexxers.

It would be cool if we could add a poll to this thread to see how many people would agree to an armor reduction change or weapon damage buffs. I know it may be frustrating for mages who are used to dexers hitting like a wet noodle, but these changes would also have a positive effect on many other things such as PVE, the economy and having more viable classes in pvp and pve is never a bad thing. Balance in all things is good and many people even those who regularly play a mage would probably enjoy having a dexer to tool around on even if it's just for PVE content. Most new players start as dexers and this would also make them feel like their first class choice was not just some temporary throwaway that is inferior to other classes for higher end content.

While I think that the suggestions for adding magic resist to armor may seem like a good idea for a temporary fix I think it's important that this shard keeps away from overtly custom changes that move things away from authentic UOR accuracy. The current problem with weapon damage seems like a simple oversight of adding publish 16 content without taking the state of dexers into consideration . There are many other shards that offer custom experiences and I think they all end up eventually being a detriment to the gameplay and lead to unnecessary complications that lead to further abstract imbalances. A simple tweak to armor rating or weapon damage should bring balance to both PVP and PVE and make dexers more viable without over-complicating things and straying from UOR era accuracy.

Armor already got nerfed for AR some time back but all it really did was put a crimp in top tier AR for plate suits and dex suits, from what I could tell.
Weapons already got their damage output normalized with a dice-roll system in lieu of the RNG, or whatever that was that Telamon did to them.

The AR values are currently well balanced with weapon damage values, when you factor top tier versus top tier. Unfortunately, the disparity is that top tier mage armor costs relatively nothing compared to any top tier weapon (GM Valorite Runic).

I believe we should drop AR value and lower val wep costs!! This way my fencer tank can drop people with a spell and swing of my spear