Discussion about "heat of battle" changes

lol, yeah, all the more reason to stack up more loot for your enemies abusing the mechanics that never existed. Nice thinking.
For what it's worth, not a single one of my combative characters has a Recall macro. Not that I won't Recall from a lopsided fight or one I just don't care to engage in, but it'll be done manually.

Kane, this is probably the thread you're talking about:
http://uorforum.com/threads/factions-heat-of-battle.10148/

For what it's worth, Broadsword's archives only go back to March of 2012. You'll need to dig into uoguide.com or some other archives for all the prior Publish notes, like these:
http://www.uoguide.com/Publishes



While I do trust Sandro's word about OSI mechanics over a great many people, I would have to see some evidence to believe that people ever got HoB for GETTING ATTACKED. This just was not ever the case in any documented history of Ultima Online production servers that I have ever seen.


If we wanna play by memory, hell, just let me know when I can cast spells with a bow equipped again. I remember that and it was lovely.

There was heat of battle on osi. This occured when you initiated combat in any situation including blues attacking greys or reds.

You could neither cast recall nor enter any gate during heat of battle. Eventually you couldnt even enter a private house if you were an aggressor.

To escape a fight you needed to run until you were neither criminal nor aggressor any longer.

It was a good system. Much better than the cheeseball shit we have here.

I am sure some people find these things to be fun, and more power to them. I am not sure what insulting them has to do with HoB/PvP

It may not be majority, but I have had many 1v1 fights vs reds.

Even though your a great friend and PvP partner I have to disagree on this. I take pride when I kill a red knowing I am normally up against an opponent that is more practiced in PvP then myself. To this end I want that fight to be a fair and equal one, I do not want to win because I had an advantage, HoB or other.

I would suggest that getting a res, new mount, new regs/pots would be a larger waste of time, under the circumstance that your are alone and outnumbered with no chance to win. Suggesting everyone dirt nap because they "should be as good" of a field PvPer as say Kane is unrealistic. The original idea here is to increase PvP participation, not seclude PvP to only "elite" players.

Recalling away is not always just to leave and not return, at least half of the time I recall from a 1v3+ is to recall back from another point and make a fresh approach.

I have no fear of dirt napping, and I do often. But just because I am dumb enough to run into a losing battle doesn't mean everyone else should have to also.

All opinion here btw, and you know what they say opinions are like...

This was not really being discussed at this point. We all know it was there, the notes are linked now multiple times.

What wasn't there, was HoB for the targets who do not return the aggression. There's a lot being thrown around in this thread but I think folks primary concerns are these:

Murderers get the shaft because blues who attack them never get HoB. I still think this is fair, because murderers have very little in the way of punishment or detriment for being evil/negatively impacting others. No, I'm not buying the red hero bullshit this time either, nor do I care if that's the RP someone's choosing.

Oranges get the shaft because they can't Recall or follow their targets through moongates, if their target didn't return their aggression. This isn't terribly common as sigil runs aren't really going on any more. All told, there should be no HoB for orange vs orange lawful combat, from what I can tell in the notes.

Heat of battle should end immediately if your opponent took a moongate or recalled far enough away. Also if they managed to run far enough away. On osi it only applied within the server lines you were in together. We would probably need a range check here.

And sigil runners touching gates is not a concern in factions. A sigil runner is only headed to one place. There is no scenario, heat of battle or not, where this is an issue.

Agreed.

Sigil runners in mid chase, have 30 minutes to flip their path to random cities as a means of losing their assailants. While it's not game-breaking, I do think it's bad and would be better to have unfettered foot paths to all sigils and a block on moongate travel. Just use pad teleporters for the island location.

Yes it was

Got anything to back that up? I know you're well versed in UO mechanics but there's literally not a shred of information I can find to support that, outside of you saying it on these forums.

Considering that is a pretty specific mechanic that has very serious implications in combat, one would think it would be as clearly laid out in publish notes as every other change to the Reputation system and Criminal/Murderer restrictions.

HoB in UO:R prevented aggressors from casting recall or using public moongates. You could certainly recall from oranges if you were not the attacker. You could also cast and use player moongates, though obviously this was a bit more difficult to do than if you could just cast recall. A fairly common escape from a HoB flag was to teleport to a roof and pop a gate off your runebook.

OSI never really documented how heat of battle worked in their UOR patch notes (it didn't exist in T2A), but I found a player guide that references being able to cast and use player moongates when criminal or HoB flagged.

http://stratics.com/threads/a-guide-to-slaughtering-the-innocent.10457/

This was in September 2002, towards the end of UO:R and that still worked. AoS hit in Feb 2003. I quit and I'm sure there were additional changes to HoB (like not being able to enter houses) but they didn't exist in this era.

.

I consider AoS as the end of UOR, for the same reason UOR was the end of T2A -- it significantly altered the mechanics and trajectory of the game. I'd say that's true even more so in the case of AoS.

Third Dawn was released in March 2001 and was really just a new landmass and a 3D client. This is before Publish 13 in August 2001, so I would consider Third Dawn to still be early UOR, and not even close to the end of it. Publish 13, for me, is the halfway mark of the UOR era. It introduced the lumberjacking bonus, casting bare-handed, increased spell damage (at what people think of as UOR levels), based harm damage off distance to target, added the strength/HP formula, re-introduced precasting, etc. and some other stuff that are taken as core features of the era but were not actually there from the beginning.
http://www.uoguide.com/Publish_13

It is rarely acknowledged that for about half of the UO:R era you had equip your spellbook in order to cast, that your HP = STR, that spell damage was unchanged from T2A, etc. It's basically the awkward teen stage of UOR. Everyone played scribe/nox mages or crushing blow macers with 100/100/25 stats. I have never seen any server try to emulate this time period. Every "UOR" server starts with Publish 13 mechanics and then cherry picks features to Publish 16, which was the last publish before AoS.

Just one more change they said, just a little more they said... then a little more....next thing we knew there was Trammel. Is anyone playing this game for any other reason besides how much you can make another person suffer? I mean there are literally 100s of other servers...with all kinds of sissy fuck fuck rules.

Why in the hell of all hells would you make it harder on smaller groups or individuals....you don't think they have enough trouble surviving a pack of horny stun mages who que drop.....allll fuckinnnng dayyyyyy.......? Let's make it so if this dipshit makes the mistake of attacking me alone on my red, I can just call in my boys and gang rape him because he can't escape....

Perhaps you are not familiar with fighting T-T? Here's how this goes down. " Hey look its two oranges let's go fight them 2v2!" * Vas Ort Flam * 2 1 dro......HOLY SHIT RUN FOR YOUR FUCKING LIFE!!!!!!!!" as 11 of them run on screen and you can bet your bottom dollar the two scouts broke your reflect.

I suggest we make a rule the prevents anyone in combat from entering town!! Oh wait... Where the hell would Woody run then? Oh Yea you guessed it, another guy that doesn't even have a PK talking about a bunch of shit...You can just go stand at the SW vesper Inn if you want to be in Trammel can't you?

I didn't actually check the link you've cited for this quote but by just simply taking the context of what he's saying it seems rather implied to me that they were clearly using the runebook mechanics for travel spells in order to bypass any criminal & HoB tags

Also now that ive read that quote I also feel like I remember using the same loophole myself to bypass HoB but I could just be reaching at straws & making shit up, I really don't remember either way that just sounds like it rings a bell once I read it, who knows.

No, that's not my job anymore nor do I care anywhere close to enough to sit here & try to dig one out for you to be honest. I don't really feel like I need to have any tangible evidence to support it - what do I possibly have to gain here by making shit up for no reason? I was just citing off memory for reference, take it however you will.

That's just how it was when I played back on Atlantic during the time, for however long it may have been that way, during whatever times that may have been. However OSI made all kinds of undocumented ninja changes whenever they felt like it tho - I wouldn't at all be surprised if it just worked both ways & got changed unannounced somewhere along the way from how it was originally introduced - On Atlantic the bigger scale Order/Chaos (Berserk for Chaos primarily, I forget the big Order guild name but they both used to roll deep) guilds used to exploit this as a means to hunt down oranges in trammel since nobody was really ever in felucca anymore & they'd just go roam around the popular banks & moongates (moonglow especially) trying to catch people off guard & gank them with blessed valorite spears before they could evade long enough lol