Suggestion to refresh factions and provide incentive to PvP.

Where is this constant shit show and all these demands you speak of? You mean people discussing the systems on the shard they play on and care about?


Please pick someone else's opinion to sway with your ineptitude and poor assessment of the situation. This is a perfect opportunity for you to eat a huge bowl of dickums. lol



No one's asking for money but if you really want to get down to it, many many months ago, Liberation ( you know him, right? ), was making a fairly strong point about the benefits of town control on OSI and that they are utterly lacking here. Seeing some form of incentive for town control other than horses and blessed runics isn't going to break anything. Again, this is just a thread discussing ideas. We all understand that you are not a fan of ideas that could potentially provide you with more fights and more people to fight though, so sorry about that I guess. No one would feel forced to PvP for profit because there's many other venues that provide that INCENTIVE as an accessory to the play style. Why is it so offensive to consider a profit center for people who....get this shit....don't want to PvM, Craft or PK?


Faction statloss has been through several variations of 0 - 20 minutes here. It's only useful in base defense really and I don't think Factions would get huge with no statloss but if it were only during certain times or perhaps within the range of a faction base, it would open the door more for players to get involved. Again, not mandatory just like making a profit is not mandatory to make it playable or fun.


The problem is that the only way to make good money on a PvP character is to go and kill other people for that money. %99 of the time, that will be non-combative players in dungeons. If there were an alternative path of employ for PvP characters, I daresay it would increase the amount of PvPers active in the field at any given time which would in turn relate to more fights for everyone.....particularly those who have a desire to do so. So while you don't think there's any need for profit, tell me then why it existed as such on OSI and carried on for over a decade.

It may sound weak, but I am curious if making the looting of enemy factioners a criminal offense may boost town fighting at least. Well, on second thought it may just boost rez killing until the body turns to bones. haha

I certainly think it should be for anyone who didn't deal damage. But that gets into looting rights and far too many would cry Trammel about looting rights.

I don't really know what causes it, I thought it had to do with looting rights and not being immediately present at the kill, but I've gotten OJ corpses coming up blue to me before... many times. This would cause the looter to go gray and has been responsible for countless amounts of guard whacks during faction fights.

I feel factions could benefit from not being targeted by hostile/friendly actions both from and to a factioner. PK can't murder you, you can't attack PK/blues... that way you are forced to interact with only factioners. Only a Minax/SL/TB could attack and kill a CoM tamer and loot him, all others would be denied those actions.

or

How about an overworld "CTF" game where no loot is dropped at all when killed by a factioner where you give a kill point, if you don't give a kill point your loot drops(reinstate standard skill loss timer)? However, if killed by monster/neutral/pk you do drop loot and can be looted.

This caused by you not doing any damage to the person before they died.

Blaise, what sort of incentives for town control do you have in mind?

(By the way, in the last few days O/C has been really active and it has been a blast.)

Honestly, it's hard to say. The greatest challenge really is stacking factions for whatever incentive may be available. Just like OSI, as I have read and been told about, people just flock to whatever faction is in control, for their benefits. If there were some blocking for that or other mitigating factors, I think an incentive that can't be abused could be found.

One thought was something like a faction 'boss' that spawns somewhere (maybe a Faction Town) and is orange to all factions. Large silver drop and fair platinum drop for killing the mob(s), but have notices go out to all Factioners while the spawn is up, beckoning them to a single location.

Perhaps an increased drop rate of platinum if you're actually fighting other oranges at the spawn, in order to secure more loot for your team.

Increased platinum drop rate for factioners at Champion Spawns, if they have X amount of kill points or recent kills of enemy factioners with greater than X amount of kill points that day.


It's hard to say and the incentive to fight, just because you can fight, is certainly not drumming up huge numbers in factions. I'll jump in Order with a character after the new year and see how that's panning out. Would still love to see some blue-interference blocking though.

Looting rights already apply in factions. If you don't deal any damage at all to a target and it dies, the corpse is blue to you. It's led to plenty of guard whacks in town.

Anyway, I'm going to reassert my claim that adding monetary rewards (especially platinum) to factions will be a disaster. It encourages collusion and allying between the factions even more, as the people who want to get rich will band together to split up the towns and exploit factions as a way to get money. It also will cause more drama, as people who are just trying to get money will be killed be the people who just want to pvp. They will of course be told that they got what they signed up for, but they will disregard this and argue that they had to join factions to be economically competitive with those who are using it to profit.
Leave the pvp systems alone, let them be for the people who want to pvp. If you want to pvp for profit, find and bust up champion spawns.

I think this is silly considering that a faction trap kill makes an OJ corpse lootable by all enemy factions. In big scale fights something like this can become annoying when different people are on different targets.

Edit
Nvm

Socrates you so silly

Like sands through the hour glass...

If people can't make money in the PvP game that was designed for just that (Factions) then they are welcome to play everything else that they can try in UO to make money. I'm not sure you actually played in Factions as much as you claim, considering how much you seem to not understand that fiscal gain played a big part in the reason for being involved. lol


Your solution translates to "If you want to PvP for profit, go be a fucking dick to other people in the game" ie: "bust up champion spawns", PKing and the like. The only way to make money for combat is to be a dick to people. There could be viable alternatives for people who aren't comfortable or interested in fucking people over all the time in game, that is also PvP. You're just worried that it will get one sided and people will team up......kinda like it does now? and always has? Good luck preventing that, incentives or not. If one team is the big dog, they will always get teamed up on.

Hmm, you mean like controlling factions so that you can place reg vendors so that you can buy regs AFK so that you can sell regs to players in bulk for a profit...

Yeah.. PvP for profit doesn't already happen.

All I'm saying, you get a handful of plat for a couple hours of work at a champ spawn, there should be some similar reward for devoting 8 hours of your life to guarding sigils that give you absolutely nothing. I get 4 platinum just about every CTF I attend, and that's like 30 minutes of fun, almost every night.

During the inception of factions there was a reason to control towns, to fight, it wasn't just because it was new but because it gave you benefits in game. The benefits it's giving us now aren't valuable with the availability of ethereal mounts and everyone plays a stun mage so who cares about weapon bless. The factions we are playing now is comparable to O/C with certain guilds also being at war with everyone.

Now you literally have no idea what you're talking about and you know it. Why does your mouth flap nonstop without your brain's help? You by your own admission have no real experience with this era of the game nor the factions system. The best you can do is vaguely say that people are talking about faction somewhere on OSI right now. Napo was the main sigil thief for the dominant faction for baja during all of this era. DocHoliday was his commanding lord and you know this person as well.

Why do you make terrible arguments to assert all your claims? Like you think there's some evidence that pking is caused because factions doesn't drop platinum. It just so happens that factioners drop all the types of loot that career pvpers care about. And even if they didn't, we'd still be out there fighting. There are many pks who don't loot at all. Believe it or not, a lot of pvpers do so just to pvp. They are all well aware that more money is to be made killing blood elementals. If their goal was money they'd be killing monsters or chasing money. But their goal is pvp so they're pvping.

The only difference is we can't raise the taxes in towns. It is this way because it would be a huge hassle to the rest of the server if they wanted to buy a house deed and it cost much more than it should have. Noone would buy high tax items except for the uninformed anyways, so Telamon or sandro clearly cut out and unnecessary part of this system. There is a good reason that he hasn't put cheaper supplies on faction vendors. There would be a lot more complaining about access to cheap regs than the two of you bored part-time pvpers asking for plat to drop in a system you spent more time talking about this week than participating in your career.

There have been many good talks about possible faction perks that don't involve squeezing platinum out of the system. And never has there been a good suggestion about making factions give platinum. Let's say you guys take the sigils and defend them in minax base. I log on my minax factioner and cap them and take your platinum. Wow pvp is awesome! There has never been a suggestion along these lines that wasn't clearly going to be abused from the getgo. And all of them at the very least have been awkward and would not feel like they fit the game or era.

On the other hand, there have been fine suggestions in the realm of cosmetics. Colored faction ethereals that may depend on rank to ride. Faction blessed runebooks. I recall HC wanted death shrouds for high ranked players. But platinum is supposed to come from champ spawns. If you think that making factions drop platinum wouldn't be immediately abused then you have no foresight at all.

Let it be about fighting. PvPers know where to get gold and platinum. Monsters drop it. I have pvped more than anyone on the server since we started and I had the very first ethereal.

I find myself agreeing with Mes more and more as the thread goes on. I think Blaise has the right general idea when he says that there needs to be more of an incentive to be in factions, but I think a conservative attitude is the way to go about that. It is obvious that the current 'perks' or the 'carrots' in the system aren't encouraging people to fight over towns.

I mean, take the fact that you can bless a weapon. Normally, I would think that more people would be trying to abuse that perk or that they would be joining the Shadowlord bandwagon so that they could try to get that - yet, this isn't really happening. Like Cynic says, most people just don't really care about it.

Maybe most of the existing perks should be rebalanced or slightly modified so that they produce something that would be more desirable, something that would prompt people to log on and fight harder over those sigils.

I think it already is about fighting and all I'm seeing is that pvp scene growing stagnant. I can recall around on any given night looking for an OJ and I find nothing. HateCrime logged in recently and spent an hour looking for a fight during primetime and found nothing. You can really only stimulate a fight one way, PK relentlessly until the other faction decides to hunt you down on their blues or IRC everyone until you can set up a fight somewhere. Either way the fights don't really go down until a thorough ghost scouting is done and both teams are happy with the odds.

Adding vanity rewards are going to stimulate factions for maybe a month and then everyone will go back to being tired of silly vanity rewards. Personally I don't find it worth devoting 8 hours of my life for a red llama when I'm going to use an ethy anyway.

I may be a part time faction pvper, but I pvp every single day/night. Just because you don't see me, perhaps that makes you the part timer? I can only do so much running solo especially when I never see an OJ to fight that doesn't call in at least 2 others. You can throw in all those jabs you want but you and your team are part of the problem. I'm pretty sure ebola looks to fight you guys on a nightly basis but there aren't any fights unless the odds are favorable to you, unless it's in your town, unless you have more numbers, etc... I would love to see you go out there solo for once and take on ebolas crew without calling in the cavalry, we both know that would never happen, but let's keep taking jabs at people because you think you're the end all be all of pvp. You once said you're not going to line up like soldiers for the sake of ebola calling your guys out for a fight... (If you want I can dig up that irc log too)

The loophole you're suggesting can also be easily fixed: Telamon can restrict players to 1 faction per IP, this was another idea that was thrown out there during the faction chat almost a year ago.

I'm not suggesting that it needs to be ALL about platinum or siphoning gold out of the system for it to be worth it, but there has to be change and it needs to make you say things like "dammit, we need to go get those sigils back ASAP", instead of how it is now: "lol sigils"

Probably for the same reasons you get your panties in a huge wad and start calling names every time folks don't jump on your ideas or rebuttal of ideas, as the gospel, oh pvp saviour glorious leadermes.

lol, get over yourself.
Factions had monetary incentives on OSI. They impacted the entire population negatively and, as such, were deemed unfit for UOR. Welcome to UOR where you've known this all along. As stated earlier, I once said there should be no incentive and everyone should enjoy it because it's consensual and has good mechanics to support it. I think I was missing the bigger picture back then, that it could be the good honest pvper's only way to pvp AND profit in this game. I know there's plenty of PKs who don't loot but there's plenty who do. There's fights where people don't loot but plenty where they do as well. No PvPer is carrying 10,000g and dropping like a wet rag when you come on screen though.
I'm not asking for plat drops in specific, or gold, or anything really. I'm DISCUSSING possible SUGGESTIONS for options to bolster pvp in factions and potentially minimize the amount of PKing which seems to always be the most prevalent form of pvp on any Felucca shard. If you're content with the numbers, good for you.

Absolutely, lol sigils. They mean nothing and the time spent hustling sigils to get convenient reagent vendors is roughly 100x more time than I would spend bumping my reagent shopping macro once an hour, as I feel like it, using normal town vendors. Sure, if you want to bless up some weapons, get a warhorse you can bond and never need a vendor for again (ie: bonding warhorses should be blocked, also mitigates excuses for having tamers in Factions), go take a town. It's really just a matter of timing because even SL is like "lol, sigils".


Many PvPers here don't need to loot their kills as PKs because they've already got Tamers anyway.[/quote]

It is stagnant. I think that's what I've been saying all along in this thread. But I don't think there's any truth that throwing money at it will help. CoM and SL fight a few times a week, that's about it. None of the groups are different about waiting until their team is on and scouting before fighting. It's boring but it's the players' fault, not the system's.

Fortunately for me there is a database that shows that I have twice the kills of any other factioner. And I don't have a history of killing my alts to mule points like you do. I recognize that you have been at home for the last month and you're smashing newbies in CTF. As for whatever you're trying to say about SL and CoM, you don't know shit about ass. Do you think I'm surprised to hear that you and com are butthurt and sit on irc saying SL is scared of you or some shit? You know what the reality is? Ebola runs from fights he doesn't like too. But atleast we're fighting I guess.

I solo plenty, I know what and who I'm capable of killing in these situations. You've really been drinking that koolaid if you believe any of the shit you just said. Have you wholly convinced yourself that i'm a newb leading newbs and we've only made it this far because there's a thousand of us and we bumbled our way into winning?

this is me killing pill in a 3on1 on the 16th


I bet that's not in the stories they tell you about SL when you guys are jerking each other off

I'd like to see you eat your words now. You've crossed that threshold from hating us respectfully to full on making shit up like blaise

No need to dig, I still feel that way. If ebola logs on irc and says "ay niga ware dem claypool" and I don't drive home from work and run into his house and get nailed against a stone oven, does that make me a pussy? How about all the times I've been on IRC in the past year, ready to fight and noone showed up. Does that make everyone else a pussy? I'm no more obligated to show up than anyone else. Who knows what their reasons are. But set up fights have always been a bore to me, and I would prefer for them to happen spontaneously. You're on every day, you seem to think you're a badass that solos armies, I assume, from this post. Why don't you log on tonight and solo com?

btw, here is a big base fight over sigils on the 21st that you guys seem to think doesn't happen - lol sigils, right? -

We've been down this road, it doesn't fix it. You just ask some chump like atraxi to grab the sigils for you. Or it wouldn't even be someone on your team. Once people know that cooked sigils are free plat they'll train 80 stealing, buy a horse and be there to grab them. It's fine for you to try to come up with ideas along these lines, but you'll need to come up with new and specific ideas. Most suggestions have already been debunked. I'm truly not here to shit on your ideas, if you brainstorm something new that feels like it would work and help the faction system, I'll be there to support it.