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Discussion in 'Renaissance Discussion' started by One, Feb 7, 2017.

Should repeated refusal to complete a transaction once an auction has ended earn a trade forum ban?

  1. Yes

    75.5%
  2. No

    24.5%
  1. WoblinTheGoblin

    WoblinTheGoblin Member

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    While I don't disagree, within a week I've been able to get myself two houses. Fairly shortly, I will be able to purchase something bigger. When I arrive at that point, it would be nice for people to learn that I am trustworthy. You are right about seasoned players, who can do more damage, than newbs like myself.
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  2. One

    One Well-Known Member
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    Last edited: Feb 3, 2023
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  3. Pirul

    Pirul Well-Known Member
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    Nice!

    What happened now?

    [​IMG]
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  4. Poogoblin

    Poogoblin Active Member
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    In a game where backstabbing/deceiving is secondary nature all for the 'ol mighty gold piece, we really do need a place where people are expected to stand behind their word and not have to worry about scams.
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  5. Rheanon

    Rheanon Well-Known Member
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    I voted "No" on the initial poll because there may be extenuating circumstances and any punishment should be done on a case by case basis. I think in cases where the staff has to repeatedly intervene on a player's transactions due to trading rules violations, his/her forum name should be posted (by forum staff) on a locked thread for that purpose. (Locked to avoid drama through commentary) Simple, easy, cheap, end of story. The name may later be removed from the Violator thread by the staff if the player shows some convincing signs of rehabilitation and/or redeeming behavior, all at Chris's discretion of course. Just my 2 gps.
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  6. Bluecrush

    Bluecrush Active Member

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    I had to vote no on this one. To much work and time involved when its so much easier to turn your back or just not deal with someone.
  7. BlackEye

    BlackEye Well-Known Member
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    Should? Yes.

    Is it realistic to implement? No.
  8. wylwrk

    wylwrk Well-Known Member

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    Personal note: rare example of logic found - mark for future reference
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  9. Sheepdog

    Sheepdog Well-Known Member

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    I think this is a tough one to navigate.

    I'm a business man though, a deal is a deal and even though there are people here (actually a whole guild) I think are totally butt and absolute wastemen, if they bid on something I've auctioned I'm going to honour the trade and follow through on my end with absolutely no shittyness or shadiness because business is business and a deal is a deal.

    I think this is something that ultimately regulates itself, people are dubious of new members dropping big bids on auctions as their first post, they remember people who redact bids, or fluff up bids, cancel auctions etc and act accordingly.

    If I'm selling 100's of fishing nets or something heavy in multiple bags to somebody who's new to the forums I'm not going to drop everything on the ground and accept a cheque at the end. I'll break it up and do the deal in sections.

    If I were to put up a fort for sale and a new member Bids as their first post I'm going to question it there and then and ask to see some sort of evidence that they can actually afford it as to not waste anyone's time.

    And if someone asks that if me I'm not going to be offended. Asking mods to get involved in something that IMO could be self regulated with common sense and safeguarding assets is a waste of their time. We're all adults here.

    I do think that some sort of forum badge signifying you being a trusted, drama free merchant and completed "X+" auctions/sales/purchases would be beneficial for all involved and could be less work for mods in the long run. Maybe with feedback left on players forum profiles like on eBay. I don't know I'm not a scientist.....
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  10. One

    One Well-Known Member
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    Last edited: Feb 3, 2023
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  11. One

    One Well-Known Member
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  12. Imbol

    Imbol Active Member
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    No.

    1) This is a game.

    2) The player probably invested substantially more time getting the item, learning about it, etc. than you spent typing "s/b" or bid increments on the forum. For that reason, their time and their agency demands higher priority in my opinion.

    The stuff is theirs and they should have 100% agency in the deal (beyond obvious exceptions, like bigoted dealings).

    3) As we saw with the Nujelm graveyard house, new stuff comes to light that changes the deal.

    4) No nuance in the proposal. Nuance/situational exceptions may change my vote.

    5) The stricter guidelines become on this forum, the more authoritative it becomes, the more people will find other less-restrictive mediums for conducting business. Stuff like this is why I sell via IRC and !yelling at banks.
  13. One

    One Well-Known Member
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    Last edited: Feb 3, 2023
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  14. Imbol

    Imbol Active Member
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    It is just as fun as it is inefficient! ;)

    1 : 1, fun : uselessness.
  15. wylwrk

    wylwrk Well-Known Member

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    Selling ostards, llamas, horses!
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  16. Brick

    Brick Member

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    The easiest way to answer this question is: what do real auction systems do when you reneg on a deal? What would Christie's do if your auction only ended for 5m instead of 10 and you just pulled the item instead? They would say no we don't want your business because you're unreliable and bum our bidders out and waste our time, though I'm sure they have a contract you sign where you can't just do that out of the blue without a financial penalty, or what I mentioned prior(reputation hit). It's not just the reputation of the seller, it's the reputation of the system itself. While banning is a bit harsh, perhaps a public thread with proof+names would suffice; a wall of shame, to be exact.

    Is it embarrassing? Sure. But it gives people a heads up and you don't have to ban anyone. Have someone trustworthy admin the thread, and only have names listed that have proof(pictures/video/whatever) of wrongdoing. Will it catch everyone? Nah. But it's good practice to SS or video trades anyway, so proof would be abundant in most cases.

    You could also put in an appeal system, for the seller or buyer or whoever the scammer was to try to mend bridges and be taken off the list; it would encourage players to remedy their mistakes. Even if you scammed in the past, you're redeemable...but it takes time to build up that reputation again.

    Quick edit: Also for the record I prefer when games don't ban for scamming, while I don't do it myself...it adds to the atmosphere imo. Scamming is a part of life, learning how to deal with said scams is a good thing. And it's much better to learn in a video game rather than real life! Eve wouldn't be the same without all the guys running Ponzi schemes etc, neither would a number of other games.

    Just my 2 cents~

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