A Red's Injustice...

Yeah, most likely haha. Unless there was some way to deter that, but I got nothin'

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I effing love how a thread seeking beneficial changes for pk's has turned into a pk punishment brainstorming conference.

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But what if the can was one of those all day breakfasts in a can type situation?

If I find worms in there I'm writing a strongly worded email to the company responsible and expect significant compensation. This just isn't acceptable. There are strict regulations and laws for food preparation and manufacturing companies that must be adhered too for the benefit of consumers safety and peace of mind.

Someone's getting fired for this, at the very least I demand a full investigation as to how worms ended up in my all day breakfast can with public responses assuring me that this won't happen again and explanations as to which measures have been put into place to further prevent this happening in the future.

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But the blues are the ones doing the town killings. I personally don't think established reds are interested in killing afk'ers.

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My whole thing is PKing isn’t PvP. Jumping a tamer with no resist farming in a dungeon isn’t PvP. Killing a miner and his packies for the lulz isn’t PvP. Killing an afk macroers isn’t PvP.

If you want to PvP join a faction. Join order or chaos. Get the dueling pits popping. There’s lots of other ways to fight players other than victimizing people trying to PvM.

PKing is part of the game and critical to the Wild West feel, nonone would deny that. But the system in place works just fine. No further penalties needed. No lessening of penalties needed.

Why would anyone wanna play UO if they don't want the risk of victimization? Do you expect to farm untouched?

You missed the point of my post entirely.

I said the chance of victimization is critical to the feel of the game. But you’re saying you want to remove all penalties for reds in the name of generating more PvP. But reds don’t get red by PvPing, they get red by murdering. I enumerated the differences between PvP and PKing above.

What you are asking for is unrestricted PKing, not PvP. And that wouldn’t generate more PvP nor lure more players to the server. It would drive people away because it would be impossible to PvM.

Again, if you want to PvP (fight people capable of fighting you back)... join a faction, join order/chaos, start up some duels. If you just want to kill people for the sake of causing them grief, do so within the existing system.

It seems that there are players who excel at and/or enjoy both PvP and PvM, but then there are also some who pretty much stick to one or the other, and I would guess the PvM camp is much bigger. There are also likely many PvM players who would would probably enjoy PvP however they see people arguing on the forums and find out that the very same group of reds who just rolled in and killed their pets just for fun while they were farming would be the very same group they would be playing the game with, and would rather not spend their in-game time with people like that.

@Celestrael is right that the ever-present chance to get PKd or stolen from is a critical part of the game, and anyone who played before Trammel came out can remember how "hollow" it felt to walk through Trammel knowing that you were 100% safe from other players. The murder system more or less works as-is and really doesn't need any shard owner intervention IMO. Reds have huge advantages here that they didn't have on OSI (3 free accounts, legal unattended burning of counts, affordable housing), however their victims also have huge advantages as well (3 free accounts, pet bonding and easy training, etc.).

From what I can tell from watching Youtube videos of PvP fights on other shards in order to try and learn how to git gud, this "my PvPer is red" mentality predates UOR, and happened sometime after I quit playing in 2001.

Really I think two events that could happen right now that would improve everyone's game play from PK perspective is for @snap dragon to get back to ambushing the PKs and avenging all of us, and for @Skunk Ape to return and show everyone how 1999 OSI-style PKing is supposed to be done.

I get what you're saying @Celestrael , but technically by definition PKing is PvP. This is because the term PvP stands for Player versus Player. So by definition it encompasses all combat between two player characters.

But I do agree that more structured PvP is a good thing and does draw players. But so does PKing. The trick is to have a balance:


I believe this shard has a great PvE and Vendoring/Tradesman side. I don't think too many people would disagree. I personally feel PKing is fine here. There are plenty of potential victims out there. That's all a Red needs. So fix the PvP side and we're done.

As a tradesman and vendor operator, I want both camps to thrive because they then buy stuff from me

Pvp has been fine there has been lots of fights. Ill kill anything moving pvp/pk if people come to a felucca server and dont expect to die you have it all fucked up. I heard farmville is cool you can go build gardens there & shit.

When i first came here i got pked and robbed like 1000X i had no idea what i was doing and nobody took it easy on me sooo idk what to tell anyone lol.

You learn.

Its a rite of passage everyone goes thru it.

I guess I don’t consider it PvP if one party can’t/doesn’t fight back. You’re just killing a player. No glory, honor, skill, etc. Its PvT, player versus target lol. Most PvM builds fold to even really lousy PKs because they weren’t designed to be hit.

And that’s fine! No one here has argued that PKing shouldn’t exist and frankly the game wouldn’t be as fun without the danger. I expect to die in the field. The very first time I left Ocllo I got dumped on by 4 Anarchy reds. That’s the game.

But redesigning Reds won’t make more actual fighting. And there are systems in place to encourage actual fighting, all you have to do is participate. Even if you’re not interested in Towns, the faction system gives you people you can fight anywhere without getting murder counts/stat loss.

I lowkey think the reason a lot of reds won’t faction is they don’t like opponents that fight back/can fight back. Prolly because they’d be the ones giving up the ghost. Lol

@Celestrael whos your faction toon?

Haven’t rolled one yet, I’ve been on the server less than a week. I’ve 6x GM’d my Provo Tamer for farming (to bankroll my crafter and blue PvP toon). I’m attended taming him to GM then I’ll be 7x, I’m at 90.

His name will be Kaelysto though. I’m pretty interested in Council of Mages but we will see, from what I was told CoM is just one guild.

I guess it's just my deep Siege Perilous roots, where you only had one character per account instead of 5.
So you had to make a character that could supply you with all your needs, and that included being able to defend yourself.
IMO, you should never be out there defenseless.

Yeah UOR is different, lots of people run purely PvM builds.

Mine is:

Provo, Music. Taming, Lore, Vet, Magery, Med. (ie no defense against PKs other than an escape macro and a prayer lol)

And you have people that run pure bards and such. Which is something I didn’t see before coming here. The PvM scene is very healthy for a Trammel-free server.

Taming and lore give you the command of all guard me most pks will die very quickly to 2 dragons and a mare to say tamers are defenseless is wrong