Vlar's Offical List of Memorable IRC Quotes!

[11:34.57] <Fooka> i'll give you unlimited free books
[11:35.11] <Fooka> and by free i mean bring me materials from time
to time
[11:35.31] <Fooka> and by materials i mean that sweet sweet ass
[11:35.33] <+Raziel> sounds good!

Another good bump for my house safety tips

Rule #1: don't pay UO drunk

http://uorforum.com/threads/3267/#post-21780

tell that to the quartermaster in the village of paws armory

That had nothing to do with excessive alcohol consumption. It had everything to do with excessive complacency!

... but it does sound better to blame it on the quarter master. Yeah, let's blame him!

6AM EST

<Wodan> eheh i love this time of the day. just drunk and wasted americans and some crazy europeans

did I leave my door open?

[13:27:26] <Chicken> walking is for chumps and poor people
[13:28:05] <Zyler> I like walking when questing with Paws
[13:28:07] <The_Hammer> Ive really never seen anyone walk in UO besides Matron, most of us run.
[13:28:46] <Zyler> Chicken called Matron a chump heh
[13:29:04] <Chicken> ^write that dow^
[13:29:09] <Chicken> i stand by my words �
[13:29:16] <Zyler> quote!

On foot is the way the pros play. Don't worry guys, someday you'll get there.

I read chicken walking is for Champs and got bummed there was an /emote I was missing out on.

[19:04:03] <Zyler> Is Santa Claus real 8ball?
[19:04:05] <Zyler> !8ball
[19:04:06] UOR is shaking up the 8ball for your question
[19:04:06] <@UOR> The answer is: Better not tell you now.
[19:04:13] <Song_Bird> YHAHA zyler - best answer
[19:04:15] <Azguard> haha nice answer
[19:04:22] <Zyler> heh
[19:04:47] Lanfear joined the channel.
[19:06:19] <Azguard> Are we getting Christmas bags this year 8Ball?
[19:06:23] <Azguard> !8ball
[19:06:24] UOR is shaking up the 8ball for your question
[19:06:24] <@UOR> The answer is: Ask again later.
[19:06:29] <Zyler> ha
[19:06:55] <Azguard> 8 ball is on point with vagueness tonight
[19:07:01] <Zyler> aye
[19:07:13] <Song_Bird> 8-ball will you ever just answer things straight up
[19:07:14] <Song_Bird> !8ball
[19:07:15] UOR is shaking up the 8ball for your question
[19:07:15] <@UOR> The answer is: It is decidedly so.
[19:07:18] <Song_Bird> ...
[19:07:22] <Song_Bird> unvague!

Do not look at this post and think TLDR, it is worth every second. Captain morgan started this epic discussion off with a simple question.

11:27 CaptainMorgan: Opinions on Short Spear vs Spear? I'm leaning toward short for its slight speed advantage, as my goal is para blows more so than damage
11:27 Blaise: That seems to be the preference in the pvp crowd.
11:27 Blaise: I like the long spear but that's just what I'm most used to working with ;p
11:28 Blaise: fencing damage is pewp, so I like the bigger hits of long spear
11:28 Blaise: vs the speed of short
11:28 Blaise: pitchforks were originally the fastest fencing weapon!
11:28 Blaise: Brady Games is the Gospel
11:30 ayek: spear looks better to pvp - short spear to pvm
11:30 ayek: at least short spear has better dps cus of speed
11:30 Blaise: is that as tested?
11:30 Blaise: I've never checked with the log books
11:33 Aberri: how can that be tested period
11:33 Aberri: when the hits are based on dice rolls now
11:34 Aberri: random is random
11:34 Xegugg: i like short or long spears, long better
11:35 elhorno: dmg isnt random aberri, its dice rolls, you gotta work with the dice you got
11:35 elhorno: so to test that, you would swing like 1000+ times and would have a better idea
11:35 Aberri: dice is random
11:36 elhorno facepalms
11:36 Aberri: thats my point u can swing 1000 times for sample a, then swing 1000 more times as sample b
11:36 Aberri: and they will be different
11:37 elhorno: so your truly arguing that you cannot test which has better dps, a short spear or long spear?
11:37 elhorno: just want to confirum
11:37 Aberri: i can flip a quarter 20 times and have it land on heads and the 21st flip it still has a 50 50 chance of being heads again
11:37 Aberri: im saying its random, it could be better in 1 test and not in another
11:38 elhorno: sample size is important
11:38 elhorno: ok, so flip it 100,000 times and lets see your results
11:38 elhorno: we arent testing single swings on these weapons, thats the point
11:38 Aberri: still is 50 / 50 no matter how many times u flip it



I felt I wasn't explaining my side well enough so I called up to the heavens:

11:43 elhorno: too bad blaise and dalavar aren't reading this lol
11:43 Xegugg: no, good
11:43 DalavarAFK: funny, I have like 2 minutes
11:43 DalavarAFK: and walk into this
11:43 elhorno: please help lol


11:45 elhorno: just to calify aberri's claim: You cannot test weapon dmg because its random... and random is random...
11:45 Aberri: all im saying is the results will vary 1000 times as much as documenting 1 swing
11:45 DalavarAFK: that is completely false
11:45 Aberri: so there can be a huge difference between 2 x 1000 swing tests
11:45 fwerp: lol
11:45 Telamon: The more data samples the more the excepted result will be seen
11:45 elhorno: ^ god has spoken
11:45 DalavarAFK: Aberri, there can't
11:45 Aberri: go try it
11:45 Telamon: If you flip a coin 10 times you could get 70% heads, but flip it 10000 times and you will get 50.1%
11:45 fwerp: that's why casino's are in business
11:46 Aberri: lol a bunch of math dropouts i suppose
11:46 DalavarAFK: lol
11:46 Aberri: thats a whole different ballgame
11:46 elhorno: were being trolled
11:46 Aberri: thats not just random thats rigged
11:46 elhorno: we mustbe
11:46 DalavarAFK: yep
11:46 Lander: hello
11:46 fwerp: how can you choose which weapon to use in UO?
11:46 Aberri: leaving before you two degrade my IQ further

Lol at the guys who think establishing a larger sample size of data will somehow magically create an "average" of a random number generator

I think we know who Aberri is on forums hahaha, and still going strong. Let me try to clarify this because I think I see where you are going wrong. You seem to think that there is this singular set of dice that controls all the damage rolls for all weapons. This is not the case. Lets take a look at the damage formula for the short spear vs. long spear vs. war hammer for instance:
short spear : 2d15+2 (4-32)
When you hit somebody with a short spear you roll 2 dice, each with 15 sides. These 2 dice are added together and then an additional +2 damage is added to that sum and TADA you have your damage roll.

long spear : 2d18 (2-36)
When you hit somebody with a long spear you roll 2 dice, each with 18 sides. These 2 dice are added together and TADA you have your damage roll.

war hammer: 7d5+1 (8-36)
When you hit somebody with a war hammer you roll 7 dice, each with 5 sides. These 7 dice are added together and then an additional +1 damage is added to that sum and TADA you have your damage roll.


So you see, when comparing weapons, you are dealing with not only in the # of dice rolled, but the number of sides these dice have.

Since the game is rolling dice to determine the damage, the more dice being rolled will make the damage output more consistent. This is easily understood by looking at what happens when you roll 2d6 (two six-sided dice). Most people know that rolling 1-1 or 6-6 for totals of 2 or 12 are the rarest possibilities. The 12, for example, requires each die to land on a 6. There's a 1 in 6 chance of each of these happening, and 1/6 times 1/6 equals 1/36. So 1 in 36 times you roll 2d6, you will get 12. On the other hand, a rolling a 7... the exact middle... can happen with the following combinations: 1-6, 2-5, 3-4, 4-3, 5-2, 6-1. Indeed, there are six ways to roll a 7, so it is six times as likely. In other words... the more dice you roll, the more likely the final result is going to be near the midle of the range.

Looking at the UOR compendium weapon damages, some weapons use just 1 die (war fork) and some use as many as 7 dice (war hammer). So the war fork is going to hit with a lot more variance than the war hammer. It rolls 1d29+3, and is just as likely to land on a total of 4 as it is a total of 18 (average) or 32. On the other hand, for a war hammer to roll its maximum, it is relying on a 1/5*1/5*1/5*1/5*1/5*1/5*1/5 chance, which is a 1 in 78,125 chance. Far more likely is that it will hit near its average (22 damage) almost every time.

These differences will not be very noticeable if you just compare a few swings on each weapon. Therefore it is wise to sample a large # of hits so you can begin to see that in fact the long spear does more damage per hit on average then the short spear.

Creating a larger sample size will give you a better idea of the "average" damage in the long run, but since every swing is completely random, that average will also give you no reliable info as to what you should expect from your next swing. If the weapon damage is say 5-45, the next 10000 swings should produce an average of 25ish per swing, but the 10001 swing could be anywhere between 5 to 45 damage. Nobody is technically wrong here, they are just arguing two different points that don't contradict one another. It's actually pretty funny.

Finally someone seems to get it. +100 likes

Also the fact that multiple samples collected of same test may yield widely varying results. I.e. sample 2 of 1000 swings may show an average swing of 30.. sample 3 may show average of 15. If this weren't true everyone should go start playing straight 5s on thepowerball.