Farewell

Bummer to hear that this was covered up. Does that EVER work? The fallout from finding out something is always worse if it was intentionally kept a secret.

Hindsight is 20/20, but hopefully that type of decision won't be made again if the situation arises. Have faith in the trust you've earned.

Man ya'll still going on about this? I figured the tears would be dry by now.

Who cares about shit in the past, doesn't affect me now. Lessons learned, move on.

<3 this server.

But I can't stop!

It is all on the person who shared the account's log in details. Sorry (whoever that was), you are resposible for your guild quitting.

As far as the other shit spewn here...I don't care about anything, except it is pretty dissapointing (to put it mildly) that admin says one thing and the truth is another.

I miss Ezekiel I always had him helping me on test with stuff and he would always ask me to help him with stuff. I knew it was Sandro from about second time on test with him. I believe he was also the one who did extensive research to duplicate ALL the world spawners as accurately as possible...ALL OF THEM!

I pretty much believe most of the things you said here to be true, really. Napo is definitely a lot more skeptical, but I imagine you can understand why one might feel that way. To me it was always more a feeling of betrayal after fighting sandro and -3- for 8 months or so and then hearing he was a GM the whole time. I mean we as a group would always be two steps behind on a guy that designed the pvp mechanics he used against us. You would have to put yourself in my shoes and imagine trying to learn the trapping and removal and guard mechanics that he designed while his tinker and trap remover and guildmaster account was public property to his group. It doesn't feel fair, although I'll probably always say the deadliest duo in any field battle was sandro and clyde. And the next were jleem and budou (which is exactly why I wasn't really excited to fight those four on the same team.) But I really understand that Telamon needed someone(s) to help design the server and put in place really solid pvp mechanics. As far as -3- using scripting or illegal programs in pvp - I don't really know and don't want to make that accusation. I can think of some of them that atleast use EUO to afk stuff that razor can't do or loot in pvp at speeds that I imagine are UOsteam auto looting. And then there's your factionmates and buddies that definitely use that stuff and talk about it openly in vent and people have screenshots and logs of them trading that stuff. It's kinda tough to be told that you just have to trust staff that everything is fair when it's like that. If anyone in SL was breaking the rules none of us would be okay with it.

I'm more than anything put off by the things HC gets away sometimes and it seems like staff have a soft spot for him (or maybe just believe his bs? I don't know.) He definitely has more than three accounts he uses regularly and staff definitely knows. Maybe there's a lot of people out there that have that and staff is waiting to stop everyone at the same time or unsure how to handle it. But it's obnoxious for someone to have 4+ factioners while you play fair and have three, or have so many extra accounts they can get lots of ghosts and blues set up in hotspots and around towns to use as cam's for fights. There were lots of guys in TT that started out and quit. I could get their account info and have a ton of accounts but it's important for us to play fair. Or even just the kind of stuff that's happening with OP - steal or scam someone, disappear for a couple days and come back acting like he had nothing to do with it. He even says in his first post that he knew it was going to happen. I'm willing to believe he didn't do it himself (staff would know although they aren't saying.) It's that much easier on him if he plans it and let's Hazy and that kid whose account was used that quit over it take the blame. But keep in mind this was a guildhouse for a guild he made and was in, and it was all his 'friends' that were getting looted. What kind of person plans this, or even just knows about it well in advance and doesn't say anything? He had long since done name changes and put secret characters into TB so I think this was something they were all in on and quite in advance. But he'll walk away from it like he had nothing to do with it and there will be another sandro's CY or sneakyT's platinum or idoc guild's loot next month. And this is the guild that had the GM in their pocket and we have to accept that they are playing fair.

Out of curiosity, who from cr3w admitted in vent to using alternate progs for looting and ago activities? It's just hard for me to believe it because the guys I primarily played with (Sandro, hc, Descartes, cynic) I never once heard any mention if it. As for kiba/jleem I have no idea as I barely played with them despite having recruiting them at the latter part of our run. We always used skype with them and if they were using illegal progs I never saw it. I did find it funny that they were accused of using sync scripts because jleem always called and used voice only with us, and we just hit target closest enemy. Any other members associated with our guild I can't speak for as the ones I just mentioned are primarily the only ones I played with.

I can understand where you're coming from about fighting against the guy who designed the mechanics, but they're not some secret knowledge, and I'm the type of player that would thoroughly enjoy mastering them just to beat his ass with it. But that's just my personality. Even still, he wasn't invincible and nothing he did wasn't possible to replicate yourself. It really just stems from our experience in the uor era and where we learned the game. It's just hard to make that case because every server he and I have gone to its always the same song and dance. We were getting the exact same accusations on second age and servers before that. People just couldn't accept the fact that there are some people who are very tactically good at this game, as well as others. My brother used to get banned from call of duty games once his name became known because he was accused of hacking. I would sit right behind him and watch him rip peoples heads off, and 5 mins later he gets kicked. He finally had to change his name, and it was astonishing because I'm watching it happen knowing the truth; that he did nothing wrong. It's the same shit wherever you go and it gets old over time.

Like I said though, I truly have no knowledge of any of my guildies I played with using said programs, and aside from Sandro knowing the mechanics, he never stepped out of line as an admin to give anyone an advantage. I've played servers with some really good players that can do what we do, it's nothing impossible and it's all achievable within the set boundaries. He was rarely around us when on his admin, and when he came over to play it was strictly that, but people can think what they want. Anyhow, this has gone on long enough and there isn't much left to say.

I don't think anyone ever accused you guys of cheating or were mad about losing. I didn't really even feel like we lost much at all. Back in february we had a bigger team and I thought we were frustrating you guys by winning. When you guys came back early this summer you had added jleem and budou and the google gang and a bunch of others and we had become a smaller team ourselves so I knew between new numbers and skill stacking we would have to pick and choose our battles carefully. I'll pm you though as far as what I know for people using illegal programs.

At the very least, the weapon damage system is secret knowledge. I've tested this and it doesn't line up with the documentation, and I can't figure out why (though it's close).

Google never played with me. Bart did, but not google.

That's beyond my ability to answer. I've no idea as I only played mages.

I had scribe come to me at yew bank and start telling me we were using sync scripts, target scripts, heal scripts blah blah. After refuting his claims for a while he went on to specifically say he heard it from napo, and so I guess he assumed it must be true.

careful what you write or how you word things, I would assume this is noted as the faction guildmaster account not his admin account, Telamon would have soiled his panties if he ever caught multiple IP's on his admin account.

I think the main issue at hand is that people are upset that information was withheld. As I said, I know it's not an excuse, but I do not think it was ever done maliciously, and it was due in part to a bigger fear of what people might think. Obviously that's not the way to go, and this is an example of why. But Chris has worked tirelessly to build the best possible server out there which is why he held such a tight watch over us. Both of them were very bitter about the uosa debacle because we all knew the true corruption going on behind closed doors over there, and so they wanted to create a fair and balanced place. I know that was their intention for fact, and they both worked hard to create that. It's unfortunate things have come to this, but I do not think for a second it was done with corrupt motives, or intentional circumventing of the players. The reality of all of this is extremely detailed and even now I can't tell you how difficult it was between Chris/zeke trying to resolve this specific issue without hurting the health of the server. That said, I also find it silly for people to be taking a video game that they play for free at THEIR expense so serious to the point f wanting to quit, and get emotionally worked up over. Their goal was to create a world that was truly history perfected and did/have done their best to do just that. If anything I'm grateful to them for that, and hope people can learn to let the little things go and see the bigger picture. Because all of this aside, it still is a fantastic server with solid opportunity.

haha...well you aren't really active right now but last week we nailed one of google's reds at destard and a few minutes later -3- and Minax were there with 10 people to try to get revenge. This included Bart, Jleem, budou, and HC wearing the -3- tag fighting alongside google and ruck and genocide and two chains and a bunch of other dudes. You may not have played with the whole googlegang as your teammates but your guild definitely does (although I have no clue what their status is now after this whole HC/Hazy/timbo looting their guild thing).

And about that team you guys built earlier this summer- even if you didn't get a chance to play with google he told me personally that he was in on it. That they had all been playing an corp and had planned to come back here and make a huge faction to take us down. I remember you said he was full of it but you didn't seem that in the loop if you didn't realize HC was recruiting all those guys (they were all getting the same PM's from him in IRC saying to join minax and he wouldn't be able to get them on the -3- stone right away but they would be able to get in skype and the guildstone was a possibility down the road.)

Boxes of max charge gheal and lightning wands, all of the same exact base item type (graphic).
That's not speculation, its damning evidence. I, and many many others, have been farming this server legit for 2 years and I can say without any doubt that there is no way I could have possibly amassed such a collection.

I highly value Sandrekiel's contributions to the server but that kind of shit is exactly why this is such a big deal.

No the admin account was NOT made public, in fact none of them were. His guild master account and trap remover account were accessible to me, and MAYBE his trap char was accessible to hate, but I seriously don't ever recall one time seeing anyone other than myself use his chars for anything.

I've admitted to having more than three accounts. This is being resolved via char xfers (still waiting for a patch). I've only ever had 3 on at one time and I still to this day only have 3 chars in factions despite your accusations. I also do not ghost or use blue characters as any sort of "cam". Again I had zero part in any theft of this Idoc guild. I set the guild up and left within the first week or two of them getting going. The reason for any name changes/ starting to move my chars to another faction was because I had become aware of some of these guys using AUO and promoting UOF behind the scenes; also they were large enough to hold their own at this point and I didn't need to roll with a 10 man group. I had several new players here who have planned to join up TB so I was going to help them get going. Hazy and Timbo both could easily tell you that I had zero knowledge of what they had planned. You can choose to believe that or to just toss my name in with something I had zero part in to try and degrade me. I'm aware of the accusation of me giving out Sandro's CY rune, but unaware that I ever touched sneakyT's platinum? The guy owed me 1.3 million from when he played here and I could not get a hold of him for a month and a half or so, either could Treasureman. I took several items that had been locked in a chest for several years to make up for this gold. I infact still have co-owner access to multiple homes of Sneaky/Treasuremans so if stealing their shit is what I was after those homes would be empty. Its easy for you all to sit on the sideline with minimal knowledge of entire situations and assume the worst because you don't like me. Despite you and two other members of your guild continually spreading rumors and talking crap about me for months the vast majority is not true. And members of your guild have accused me of using razor party synks and other nonsense in pvp as well. Anybody who has ever been in skype/vent with me while we pvp knows different. The only bit of any of this that is valid on me is me having more than three accounts. I personally approached Telamon myself in regards to fixing my account usage to stay within the rules and I do not abuse having access to more than 3 accounts.

Hazy and Timbo can both comment in here and let you know whether I had any part in the looting, or if I knew in advance. Although I'm guessing Timbo is likely to never step foot in this thread.

Yeah that's definitely past my active time. I remember toward the end if my activity there was an issue with some guys thinking we'd guild them, I said no, and then there was some drama that I didn't take part in. It's been a couple months since I've really sat down to play.

I think this is totally true, really. And that;s why I was happy to go right on playing after I found out (and why it's taken this long to come to light.) I mean we had to fight the gamemaster and his buddies all that time, and then we found out and as much as it didn't seem fair to us we kept it quiet eight months. If it wasn't for this constant drama and shadyness that has really been more about HC lately than -3- I doubt anyone would be claiming favoritism. It probably would have been a much better policy to just come clean about it back when sandro was removed as a GM though so this didn't fester.