So Filling Bulk Order Deeds is Tedious - Lets talk changes.

So you specifically broke existing macros just so you can eventually change the system and allow macros to accomplish the same thing? What the hell is the point of breaking the existing ones?

Personally, I would loop a macro crafting an item by type and just put non-exceps in a corner of the bag while adding the good ones to the deed. When I got overweight, I'd run a smelt by type loop.

Reducing abuse.

If I turn in 100 BODs in a week, how is filling them in a row with macros "abuse" if I'm using a shard supported program? Especially, when based on these last few posts, it is going to be allowed anyway but you have to use Telamons macro to do it.

Because, quite frankly, Razor shouldn't even exist and anything done excessively with it, is abuse, in my rarely humble opinion.

The issue isn't people turning in a hundred bods a week. It's people turning in several hundred bods a DAY. If you have to turn off the fountain to stop everyone from filling their jugs as well as their bellies, so be it. As long as you can still walk your ass to the pond and get a drink, no one's stopping anyone from drinking.

What is the point if this post if you already have decided what you are going to do?

It's really annoying how this server rushes bad "fixes" to non existent problems. Instead of rushing a bad fix then posting a "discussion" where you rebuke or dismiss everyone's ideas why don't you post a real discussion BEFORE making huge, sweeping, radical changes?

I think I speak for everyone when I say that. Moreover I think everyone is equally frustrated because we all know that these changes are permanent. At best you will reduce their severity but they are here to stay!!! Because reverting back to the troll patch would be a recognition of this patch's short comings.

Chris is an entrepreneur. I understand he runs his own company, and is very successful. He started UOR on his on his own. You DO NOT accomplish these sort of things without a certain degree of determination, pride, and dogged stubbornness. This is a guy who has probably faced failure more times than we know and said "F-that." I respect that in you Chris. But on the flip side sometimes your stubbornness & doggedness frustrates us. Your often time anal attention to detail has resulted in an awesome and high quality shard on which we all love playing UO. But on the flip side you sometimes micro manage every thing to exhaustion and make mountains out of mole hills. I guess what I am getting at, is it's impossible for me to sit here and say "You are too stubborn" or "You are too this or that" because I know and respect the fact that these qualities are what set you apart and UOR apart. What I am saying though is that SOMETIMES knowing when to step back and reevaluate your vision and listening to people is not a bad thing either.

Don't lump me in with your 'everyone'. These changes make me happy along with many other people. Your superlatives are not only inaccurate, but wildly off base.

Clearly in your infinite wisdom about accounting, you now know everything about everyone who's ever run their own successful business. I applaud you for your completely unabashed ignorance of the rest of the world. Truly stubborn businessmen tend to fail because they cannot compromise or find solutions to problems by trying change. Not that I'm an MBA or expert in business but I sure as shit know a lot of business owners, successful and otherwise.

Try less anger and more conversation about why you need a million ingots and how to potentially resolve that need with a viable alternative.

Y

Ooo Blaise.... Your trolling is boring

I see you are too inept to muster a tangible response and have resorted to standard issue Double Vision reply of "oh you troll, you".
Stop being such a chump.

Kind of a tangent, but... if you're providing a direct translation of copper to platinum, then there is no point in having copper at all. It just makes things confusing.

I mentioned this above, but I'd say generic by type. If you start tinkering with values by the materials and quantity and such, you're just creating inefficiencies, and you're more likely to harm new players to the system, who might not know that they'd likely get more from selling a high end BOD to another player than turning it into the system. I wouldn't even adjust by large vs. small. They all take the same amount of time to request and obtain.

Otherwise, great to hear much is in the works!

Its an irrelevance, it was already addressed perfectly by Lud, and if hoarding is this much of an issue then a whole lot more needs to change than mining and BOD's. Why do you need to own everything purple? Why did DaTamer put so much effort into collecting every 1st year anniversary bag he could get his hands on? Why does Dalavar have a long-term goal of completing at least one of every relevant large BOD in the blacksmithing system? Why does SIRSLY have around 500k boards that he's spent the last 8 months collecting over time? Why do I keep every magic item I collect off of dead mobs, regardless of quality, for the sake of CUB?

Because we can. And thats the beauty of UO.

What I consider the biggest injustice here is the foundational changes to how things work within the game simply aren't in line with any experience I ever had on OSI in 1999/2000. I joined this shard with the expectation that it would continue to feel that way, and have gritted my teeth as it drifts further from that. This is bordering on the custom shards that I actively have avoided in my play career.

Yes, we have seen the end results of the extreme levels that things can go to. Thats not a problem here, due to a number of existing systems that ingeniously made these nonstarters when it came to scale of damage to the economy. The fact that we're still at less than 500 million gold in existence says that its working. Is there still more that could be improved from a perspective of gold sinks? Sure. But we're simply not at a point even nearly saturating the existing market with most harvestable resources on this shard, much less people setting up industries around them. Since Red Rover quit, no one has gone into a commercial operation mode at any kind of large scale -- and even he didn't target the colored ore that is of limited supply and existing concern.

If it weren't for the fact that you already had these problems solved for in a way that ingeniously did not affect the feel of what I experienced in 2000, I would have never joined this shard. But the removal of even the ability to recall into caves, for any reason? The expectation that if you want higher output you have to be a PvMer, not a crafter? Not so much.

Amounts are irrelevant to this conversation, IMO. Its functionality that you've gutted. If you're going to disallow ability to use Razor, you should just commit to negotiating features. Thats all you're doing here, just in a way that will lead to people confused and frustrated, and leading to far more administrative work for you to handle. Being able to trigger on guild/party msgs? Sure, great, burn it -- it allows an interconnection of clients that is above and beyond. Being able to determine that theres no longer any wood to chop from a tree? Absurd. Athena already said it -- everyone has been actively encouraged by staff to look into HateCrime's 'Next Tree!' macro for the better part of 2 years -- and now that macro won't even function.

You know what functionality has been removed; why does it need to be spelled out?

With that logic, you should start making AFK gumps on the following gathering acts as well:

• Using spinning wheel to convert wool to cloth
• Creating anything that can be sold on a vendor (spell books, armor pieces, kegs, etc)
• Buying reagents and ingots from NPC vendors

I think its safe to assume that won't happen though as the primary offenders of those actions are in much higher standing with "staff".

You have your mind made up, its your server. These discussions are a sham in the sense you aren't looking for actual feedback, just going through the motions. Hell, you asked for ideas on how to fix BODs and mining with the conditions that you won't change BODs or ore. Crazy.

And they should -- but only on basis of large vs small. The actual value should be irrelevant since the vast majority that will be turned in will be of dubious quality anyway. There shouldn't be any kind of sliding scale based on where it sits on the BOD matrix -- the BOD matrix is irrelevant because you already decided its rewards weren't worth your time or effort. I'm pretty sure thats what Dalavar is advocating.

Yep, that's my point. Though by that logic, I don't think you'd differentiate between large and small.

For copper coins, I guess I see the point. On the positive, it will be a nice color to add to the cliche "pile of riches" room

I agree with all your points against Razor. After building my character skills I used it very little. The only time I used it for purposes other than skill training was to make large batches of one item (but only to hit make last). I manually restocked cloth, cut up rejects, filled the bods, put more kits in my pack, etc etc. I had some weeks where I was turning in a few thousand BODs that I did mostly by hand. I don't much like the idea of a program and script doing a larger amount of that work in order to significantly increase that number.

I know that's not a popular opinion for some of you, but it is my opinion. I play UO to play UO, not let a script play for me.