What are the actual odds that dexxers will ever be useful in PvP?

Discussion in 'Era Discussion' started by TreeHugger, Dec 27, 2016.

  1. wylwrk

    wylwrk Well-Known Member

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    the flock must identify and agree what max efficiency is

    anything contrary must be quickly silenced


    So, I dunno why the argument is about mages and dexxers when clearly you all should be playing tamers.

    Get with it.
  2. Bayara

    Bayara Well-Known Member

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    The two things that mages have going for them is that if they cast the spell it will be a given "hit". As long as the other person doesn't have MR up, OF COURSE.
    And that spell damage is very consistent and reliable.
    You aren't going to ebolt someone and get a random value between 2 and 40.
    Imagine if you ebolted someone and instead of seeing a damage value float up skyward you just saw *wiff*.
    Especially if they had 5hp left.
    Hot diggity-dog that would be frustrating!
    This is the pain of the meleer.
    Obviously it shouldn't work like that though because a mana investment is being made on the mages behalf.

    The consistent garaunteed damage of the mage is what makes it shine.
    And that's no secret to anybody.

    People giving advice like "you just have to know how to play the dexxer... The secret is to stick to them like glue".
    Duh!!! That's no secret.
    Believe me... as a dexxer, I think I can speak for the melee addict community when I say... We are always testing and brainstorming every possible tactic under the sun to gut the mages.
    It exists in our minds like meth does to a scabby strung-out teen.
    On production shards I found that necromancy was the solution to dealing with mana junkies.
    Here... It's more like womens rights in the 50's.
    You just accept that boys will be boys and that's the way it goes.

    So yes, a melee temp can still beat a mage.
    Certaintly!
    But it's not solely due to skill.
    It's because the luck and dice rolls lined up well too.
    You got ting-ting-ting with good rolls when it counted instead of ting-wiff-wiff.
    In a ten duel set with a mage, the ones the meleer takes were because of good rolls (mostly, excluding a slip up or other such mistake).
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  3. PaddyOBrien

    PaddyOBrien Well-Known Member

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    would be nice to be able to switch from a weapon to a bow and fire off a hit while being stunned... so gm archery / melee would be used more. as far as I know it is subject to a delay.
  4. Bayara

    Bayara Well-Known Member

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    Yes.
    A bow shot as an instant opener os good.
    Then switching to a speed weapon is very functional.
    The other way around though...
    The wait delay offers too much recovery time for the opponent.

    But i may start playing around with archery AND fencing for that opening heavy shot.
    Of course upon death i would risk two good weapons...
    Expensive re-arm temp.
  5. Mandevu

    Mandevu Well-Known Member

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    The secret is not sticking to them like glue. That's just a given. Which further enforces the reality that there is more to knowing how to play a dexxer than simply point and click. If you are really good at playing a Mage, you understand how to beat a Mage when playing a dexxer. And that's the entire reason why you don't know how to beat a Mage, because you don't understand how to master playing one. When you do, it makes playing a dexxer 10x easier. So while you sit there and brainstorm different ways, you'll probably never figure it out. And it's not some secret trick, it's simply just knowing how mages work, and knowing how to defend and attack against them.That's what most people don't understand. And every time I listen to some of these comments I immediately understand why you don't understand.
  6. Mandevu

    Mandevu Well-Known Member

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    All boasting aside, I am hands down one of the best mages to ever play here. My old partner, Sandro, was also one of those who was the same level as me with a mage, arguably better. He played a dexxer named Torin Gorefiend. Of the times I fought his dexxer with my Mage I was never once able to win. Why do you think that is? When I can run around and crush almost every other dexxer, as soon as I fight one that understands mages as I do, and suddenly I'm unable to win. In fact, I spent the majority of our fights on defense because he knew how to defend against my combos. Once that was over he had free reign of offense, which is more than just swinging and following.
  7. Mandevu

    Mandevu Well-Known Member

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    Eh, fuck it. None of you are going to ever get it or agree. So I don't care. Squabble away.
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  8. Bayara

    Bayara Well-Known Member

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    Awww cmon!
    There is obviously more to it than point-click-follow.
    There is a time for being a glue feind and a time for hit and runs.
    Both those times occur off and on in the same fight.

    I hit, move, use cover, interupt LoS, hide, glue-stick all in a single fight.
    Don't assume my entire identity on one statement.
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  9. Mandevu

    Mandevu Well-Known Member

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    Nvm. I'm not talking about some duck, dodge, dip, dive crap when playing a Dexter lol. That's exactly what I'm talking about. You're missing a giant element when playing a dexxer and it has everything to do with understanding exactly how Margery works; like I said earlier, how you point and click is a default trait of playing a dexxer. There's much more to it.
  10. scuba

    scuba Well-Known Member
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    I agree with you. I hate nox fencers they are the worst. Do not forget about LJs aswell man they are deadly.
  11. Bayara

    Bayara Well-Known Member

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    So lay it on me then...
    I'm always open to good input.
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  12. Mandevu

    Mandevu Well-Known Member

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    I tell you what. Shoot me a PM and I'll get with you in game and show you some things. Learning it isn't something you can just write in text.
  13. Mes

    Mes Well-Known Member

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    This is like literally what I don't agree with though.

    The problem with these templates is - assuming an even playing field in latency and player skill - your opponent has to choose to trade a hit with you in order for you to swing. As long as your opponent is smart enough to say "hey, I'm at 40% health" or "hey, i'm poisoned" then they just keep moving while they cure/heal until it is safe to allow the dexer to trade a blow again.

    The reason I say that para blow and stun punch templates are the only ones worth playing on this server is because those templates can buy the attacker an extra five seconds of dps time.

    Sure, a dexer or poisoner can whittle down your resources over time. Then just leave the fight by moving in the opposite direction and resupply. Dying would be entirely your own fault.

    As fights get larger than 1v1 the margin in which mages are stronger becomes larger since they can guarantee their damage within 10 tiles of their target and dexers neither know when they'll hit or if they can all hump the same target at the right time.

    If you're talking about pvp in a box or on foot in trammel areas then that is pretty different but so I want to be clear I'm talking about real mounted combat.
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  14. Bayara

    Bayara Well-Known Member

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    I am a learn-by-doing person anyways.
    Today and tomorrow are very busy but I'll hit you up soon.
    Curious..........
  15. scuba

    scuba Well-Known Member
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    I guess I was thinking more in regards to some of the previous Friday night fights I have attended. I've always been matched against the nox dexxer and or the LJ. In that scenario where you are fighting 1 v 1 in a small area that style of combat is hard to fight against IMO. I mean hell even Pax lost to Sterling Archer on his nox fencer.

    Group fights/Faction combat gimme Mages all day
  16. Mes

    Mes Well-Known Member

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    Oh sure. On foot and in a box in a 1v1 dexers are pretty good.
  17. Mandevu

    Mandevu Well-Known Member

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  18. Valrick

    Valrick Well-Known Member
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    Only hybrids that ever got me good were ones that kept the spear hidden until later in the fight.


    Run down my mana then whip out that stick!
  19. Pax Romain

    Pax Romain Active Member

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    I lost that one fairly early into the match because my razor settings were fucked up.

    Best template in the arena or FNF tournaments is the stun heal mage if you are really good and can throw purples. This describes maybe five or six people on the server. Anyone else is better off playing a dexer in tournaments if they're trying to win.
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  20. Zim

    Zim Active Member

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    Listen. Please dont take this as a personal attack. This is a conversation about whether or not dexxers are ever going to be useful in PvP.
    lol. Im not trolling you and if you ask my wife, yes. Yes I am retarded.

    Look at the 7x leaderboards here. Not the 5x leaderboards, not the 7x MAGE leaderboards, the 7x ones where dexxers are considered playable. I didnt go too far past the top 10 but in the top 10, 80% of them are some form of stun mage. Of the other two, one was an ARCHER tank and the other one I honestly only saw mage/eval/med so I cant say what that guy was, other than a mage, one way or another.
    In a 1v1 duel setting, the cards arent going to be stacked any better for a melee type toon.
    Yet STILL, mages are on top 10 out of 10. That cant just be coincidence.

    Im just saying that outside of para blow, DP, and 2 shotting someone with a million dollar axe, dexxers got it rough.

    If archery was fixed, I guarantee yould see a bunch more bows out there. If concussion blow wasnt super nerfed, I bet yould see a lot more halberds and axes out there too. If macing was EVER competitive outside dexxer on dexxer fights yould actually see a macing weapon out there.

    and please, Im not saying that a dexxer will never get a kill. Im just saying that with the ruleset as it stands, they would get a lot MORE kills with a stun mage.
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