My thoughts on the new mining changes

Fun is relative, and as both Dalavar and Paradigm touched on, for some of us BOD's ARE fun. They're fun in the same way that people get addicted to video poker or slot machines -- its you vs a random number generator with fingers crossed.

As far as the cave trolls are concerned, I approve of this; it gives me a justified reason for paying far too much attention to my miners when they run. Which, to be fair, I would be doing anyway.

Because I want standing armor, Phoenix Armor and Runic Hammers 1000x more than I want a dresser or vanity for my house.

I have only been mining for a little over a week. I recall and mine, but I don't think I am a "recall miner" that is mentioned here - my macro mines in four directions, and recalls to the bank for unload and restock after reaching a certain weight. I manually choose where he goes next, and I walk him from spot to spot when the vein dries up. I mine an hour, sometimes two while I play another character. Multitasking!

That said, that cave troll is waiting for me to glance at another character. He caught me twice this morning looking at the left side of my monitor and made sure I paid for it!

I even had two spawned at the same time again.

I like the added challenge - I'm going to keep at it and adjust how I play accordingly.

Okay well what I am getting at is if you do not go out and socialize with new and old players alike, by the time you get all your hot loot it will be too late to even make an impression and make memories.

Some of us have been playing this game for over a decade...now, this server does have lots of unique and fun stuff to do (events/amibs/etc/etc, all of which I still do participate in while also doing BODs), but I don't really feel like I'm missing out on anything that I've been doing for the last 10+ years by spending time doing BODs.

BODs are the Devil.

Anyone got 10 Exp Leather Sleeves?

No one can tell anyone how to enjoy the game. I love mining and bs/bods. Also a troll spawned again wile i was mining the old fashion way, but he found my ev's a bit too much and perished.

This is my point exactly. If you don't like doing BODs, or haven't done them. You can't really weigh in on this discussion. We are playing the most open form MMO for a reason. No one can tell me what template to use with my miner! I shouldn't be punished for making a silly build of any type! I appreciate you are worried that I might become lonely in my house, but at this point in the history of man.. we need every type of UO player on this server that we can get. How many people actually still want to play this game anymore? Why chase them away or poop on their play style?

I guess I got my feelings hurt when miners responded to the changes and we got slammed with negativity from the community. How would you like it if there was an AFK gump when animal taming, or training basic PVP skills? Why should I have to mine ingots by hand but you can take stat loss, res, retrain AFK and then come kill my miner[again]!

AFK Macro gumps for murderers. Yes please ;P

There is enjoying something, there is exploiting it. There are people that enjoy exploiting things but doesn't mean they should, since it ruin things for others in some ways.

What exactly are you calling exploiting? I hope not recall mining...

You know how many people run recall bots to buy regs, buy arrows, chop tress, scavenge rares, etc... This is part of the game when you allow razor. What they don't want you doing is doing any of these things AFK, hence the AFK gumps. I think the added changes are overkill.. but I've come to the conclusion that my input is rarely taken into any consideration especially since I don't play this game the way some people would prefer I play it. Tangent... anyway... My point is recall mining is not, in any way, exploiting. Some retards found a way to mine using a method that was absolutely an exploit, but I think this recent patch was like using CPR on someone that's got a paper cut.

There is a very small player base that recall mines and an even smaller base that does so to sell the resources off instead of converting them to their own benefit.

If you don't think there are people that recall around in a macro to do things in this game then you are very very wrong.

Recall mining on three characters for 8-10 hours a day, is abuse of Razor, not really an exploit. Using multiple shovels at the same time is an exploit as it should not be possible unless you have a pair of hands for each shovel. 0 Use delay is clearly not correct, so the 1s use delay is appropriate.

People who were not abusing this or exploiting the use delay did not actually have to change anything, other than their reaction to the results of this activity. ie: get out there and kill monsters and expose yourself to the rest of the game, like the rest of the people playing.

I don't see how this is an "abuse of razor" if I can, and many people have, used razor to raise hiding or other skills for 24 hours a day... and done so on all 3 accounts.

This argument should apply to people who scavenge rares on 3 accounts, no? We can't ruin their gameplay though because rares collectors are the cream of the crop, amirite?

How about people that use three accounts to recall around buying regs? Chopping trees? Fishing? FLIPPING BODS?

How about people that sit at IDOCs and run a loop to check the house sign so as to get the exact fall timer?

I'm not trying to spin this out of control and I'm starting to get to the point that I'm getting argumentative and passionate about my viewpoints which can make this thread get dumped into trash talk quickly.

My point is that if there's an exploit then fix the exploit, don't implement changes that punish the people playing the game to play the game. A few idiots want to exploit then address those idiots, not everyone.

Yes, and Rare Gatherers get the gump also for collecting unattended, if I recall correctly.
I don't know anyone who reagent shops on all three accounts and quite frankly, I'm not even sure if Treasureman does it unattended.
Lumberjacking should spawn mobs too for recall LJs.

Fishing has to fight monsters regularly. Tell us again how that is unattended and causing a massive influx of resources into the economy that would otherwise not exist.

Flipping BoDs just simply CANNOT be automated unless you are using illegal third party apps. You can get close and have your actual work reduced, but full auto is impossible.

IDOC timers? lol, who cares.



Oh and I almost forgot: Running three recall miners while you watch Netflix is NOT PLAYING THE GAME.

Yeah, because between you and I I'm definitely the person with the history of getting uber mad for the silliest of things. BIG lol here..

anyway..

My argument isn't over the simple AFK gumps, I'm perfectly fine with those because contrary to popular belief recall miners (me especially) watch their miners like hawks.

You can run 3 people recalling off of rares books and pick up 1 rare that will sell for the equivalent of what a days worth of recall mining will produce. Otherwise you can recall around with 3 accounts and pick up 10 rares for the same input of cash... but I guess you don't remember Upgrayyeds rares vendor? I'm not saying this is what he did but it would be silly if he didn't.

Again, afk gump is not my issue here, I like the gump... it's the added attack at the recall miners with the spawn. I don't care about the delay, doesn't affect me, and was probably broken the way it was.

Also, reg shopping is done afk by at least one person, which has been proven time and time again by your friend, matron.

If you don't think this is an abuse then I have news for you. Keeping reg vendors stocked is extremely difficult to do without the afk recall reg shopping. Buying regs from the NPC's in town is also extremely difficult to do when you are fighting with the recall buyers.

But let's not address this, it cannot be an abuse... no way could it be...

Bro, you are the one who posted pics of monitoring your macros from the shitter with your cell phone. Thank yourself for the miner-attack patch nerd.


Keeping a reg vendor stocked is no where near extremely difficult. I wrote a guide for reagent buying via macro and get this shit....I even used it. I stopped because I personally don't like running vendors and the tedium of actually stocking them bored me to tears. I thought Treasureman was running those shopping macros manually while he was here because specifically he said "I've gotta go shopping" to me before. I kinda figured that meant he was there doing it.

I don't know much about the rares market here but perhaps it's because I don't value any of them much at all. What I do value, are high end smith bods which I get from working my ass off in the mines and the forges. My macros still work fine and now I have the added bonus of mining not being super-ultra-boring. Hell, I've only been PKed on my miner ONCE here since I started in Beta.

So tell me again where AFK rare collecting, reagent PURCHASING (ie: not resource addition but resource conversion) is a negative impact on the economy as a whole.

Also, this isn't UOSA. I have never had to fight with recall buyers to get reagents either. I have a buy agent for 50/each and I hit a shop or two at most with my Vendor Buy before I'm done.

I am pretty sure no one is running recall rare hunting macros. Due to the randomness of the timers, location variance and requiring stealing or opening containers it would be a mess of a macro to run and extremely inefficient since on any given day only a handful of rares may actually spawn out of 50+ locations. (many of which are in dungeons).

The practically risk-free money machine of recall mining was fun while it lasted but the change seems to make sense. It sucks that some new folks with a little magery running around with pack mules can get mowed by these trolls but Im sure the system will be adjusted as necessary. At some point Im guessing the running 3 accounts thing will need to be reviewed but thats a whole nother can of worms.

I can do many things from my cell phone, like working skills... COLLECTING BODS... and even flipping them. It's not hard and if my picture was the sole reason then that's damn silly.

Guess I'll post a picture of me collecting bods from the shitter next so maybe that'll get changed... but it won't, and we all know why.

It is difficult, I've run vendors before, perhaps not a reg vendor because I didn't want to compete with Apoc, nonetheless, it's difficult. He had to, along with Tamer, go around multiple times a day to collect regs manually. We have people that do it via macro now and it's profitable for them. The reason it's not mentioned as much is because there aren't a ton of people hopping on that bandwagon, yet.

You care about specific aspects of the game, as do I, and mining for profit was one of them. I collected BODs but I haven't nearly come close to flipping them in the way some of the major BOD flippers do. You may not care about rares, understandable because I don't either, but there are people that use razor to collect rares and produce the same profit miners do, they just have 0 risk. Am I calling for a nerf, of course not, but it's a double standard. You can't penalize 1 resource/item/whatever gatherer and leave all the others alone.

I also don't see how recall mining had a negative impact on the server as a whole, please explain. Mutombo's ingots are for sure horded over a span of time, it's not like he mined for a week and made 8 mil in ingots. If he did then that's because of an exploit (although I doubt it). I've seen only 3 popular ingot vendors in yew, how is this ruining the economy? Even with the sheer amount of mining I do I would never have the ingots needed to flip like you or some others do; I would need to purchase from other recall miners.

I never played UOSA, this is my first free server. I have, for sure, fought with people who sell regs on vendors. Recalling to every mage shop in brittania and not finding more than 20 black pearl or root is a problem. Does it happen often? No, of course not.