Regarding these ultra-pro PK discussions

I think server growth / pvp activity will pick up now that the final land rush is over. If anything it's hard to actually judge whos coming / going right now especially after the land rush.

Even if new players are starting here in UOR they are probably standing beside a bank somewhere macroing or are either in a friends house macroing.

If you start from scratch here and lets just say you're going to make a tamer, or a bard ... or anything. It takes a solid week of macroing just to GM one skill. And that's if you are very consistant with staying logged on and getting all of the materials you need to actually macro.

I ran macros for about a week before I could even really do anything on the game worthwile...


About pks and no stat loss, I just lol at that. It's crazy to think that a player who goes around and kills other players for fun shouldn't have to have some type of drawback from dying. That's part of the thrill of being a pk, surviving. There is a way you can be a Murderer and not take stat loss upon death though. Just get a few kills and stay logged on and burn counts. You can atleast do this long enough to get comfortable and confident that you as a player are well equipt / skilled enough to stay alive. Then proceed into stat loss once you've reached that point.

If someone kills you or you die when in stat... well you were careless, play smarter.

It does seem most people are more worried about items and craftables, other than game play. At least according to the forums.

UO has always been about player interaction. This game is insanely boring if you can just run around and not see anyone, have free reign in a dungeon, and mine uninterrupted. PKS are a necessary evil, they keep gold from flowing and can keep resources at a premium. Ive played about every style, and my favorite was a PK hunter. If you think that OSI did not have pks in mind, why would they even implement them? They honestly make the game fun. That is why trammel effected UO so harshly. Who cares if you die to a pk? Honestly it forces new game play, all I hear is I cant kill them with my bard or im not good enough ect ect. Well make a character that is a bard that can fight. Or dont go out alone. Just because you cant roll a 7x bard and farm gold all day, is not a reason to crap on other play styles.

Stat loss was the worst thing they could have added to pks, it was done to elevate all the crying of the populous. All it did was make PKS more cautious. Now they ran in packs and did fast hit and runs. Pretty much what everyone complains about. I can honestly tell you, I rarely run from PKs. No reason to, most of them are not even good. In UOSA my brother pretty much kited two to vesper from harpies and killed one in the process. All he had was high resist with GM tactics and Swords. His name was allyoucaneat if anyone cares.

I remember being very cautious when I left town in LS back in the late 90s. It made for a better sense of adventure. Worrying if I could walk to brit without losing all my crummy items.

In my opinion, PKs should have a temporary stat loss according to their kill count. This way, when they die they cant get right back up and attack you. So if you kill them you can go about your business. If you don't, well, to bad so sad. Pks are just as an acceptable play style as bards and crafters. They introduce danger and can bring many people together to go hunt them.

Honestly with such a low population, having pks macro off counts just hurts the server. We need faster game play while alleviating down time. Grabbing some guys that like to PVP while you dungeon, is a great way to stop PK's, while bringing PVP to the ones that want it. No reason to nerf a play style because you cannot adapt.

"all I hear is I cant kill them with my bard or im not good enough ect ect. "

From who? LOL

It was paraphrased from your comment "I don't want those kills and I don't want to fight you or run on my bard". It might be taken out of context, but what I came across is that you don't wish to run from PKs, via a recall stop. To be honest, it doesn't matter what YOU want. You make your case and on you go. The idea is to make this a fun game while balancing. There are other way to balance than what OSI/EA did. Their goal was to give pvp via factions and keep the farmer happy. Pking was a bane to EA, but not to the game in general. There are much better ways to punish PKS while keeping the play style fun for both.

I would like to be able to hunt PKs without them instant recalling because they will have to macro off counts or re macro skills. Instead a timed stat loss that starts after they rez, would keep them from coming back and smashing a "farmer". They might wish to attempt a kill with WHILE on stat loss. Guess what? It might make for a more balanced fight for the farmer. Maybe even add a timer to recall that scales with kills (or like in my concluding paragraph). PKs should be coaxed to fight instead of running. It would even give more of a reason to roll hiding and tracking.


Honestly recalling was always out of hand. In my opinion recalls should have been scrapped all together. It really takes away from the game overall. 50 something mages with scrolls can recall? It makes the world so useless and empty. Like I said in another post, World of Warcraft had it down, with forcing combat by having hearths on a 30 minute cool down and over 8 seconds to cast. However, no one would enjoy the scrapping of recall. So extending the cast would be another way to go about it. Maybe even scaling skill with cast time. I understand not everyone wants to PVP, it is, however, a part of the game, and when you leave the safety of the guards you are free game. A safe UO is a boring UO.



These posts are quite long, so I apologize ahead of time. I always hated it when people built walls of text.

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Remove Recall into and out of Dungeons, as well as gate in exchange for removal of Statloss.
Sounds like a fair trade off.

I think scaling recall time with kills on top of not being able to recall or gate into any dungeon would be great. No idea how long or how many but it would either tone down some pks, or force many more fights. It would be fun to hunt them again. Same thing with gate travel. Making it so they have to wait before entering a gate scaled with their kills. This way, they cant cheat the system. Moongates too.

I still think they should occur a temp stat/skill loss, even 5 to 10 minutes after resurrection. Just keeps them from coming back over and over. When they are beat, the winner should get some time free to farm or whatever.

It would be so nice, this way they cant sit a ghost somewhere and wait for some poor target, recall in, kill, recall out. It is an exciting prospect. All while keeping the aggressor non recall thing, and it seems like a fair system. Maybe even adding to the aggressor timer, so they cant just leave 2 minutes after killing someone.

May kill off all dungeon farming with this. Have to walk out of dungeon just to gate back to bank your loots.
PK could just sit and farm the entrance all day, never have to venture in to get to you.

Oh yeah, shitty.
Leave as is.

Although...

Dump recalling in and out of Dungeons but leave gating. Technically it's a more powerful spell, so should achieve a bit more. Make it a longer cast to give the Pks time to interrupt, therefore we have our dungeon access AND it won't be quite the FAST CAST Emergency Oh Shit button for escape. (Put it on a cast time of Blade Spirits or a tad less?)

Edit: if you get the spell off you can gate through, if an opponent Flags you but does not do damage you can gate through, if an opponent Flags you and Damages you "your spirit is weakend and unable to gate at this time"

Just an idea.

As for Statloss, I'm not sure how this works, I've not had a red that this happened to.
If a 4short + count murderer dies to a mob, they should not take stat loss. To keep reds from running into a mob for last hit deaths during PVP, if said murderer takes more % of damage from a player, Statloss still occurs.

That way Reds can farm too But like I said, I am unsure of how it works concerning Reds and Mob Deaths currently.

Its not like farming isnt easy enough. Honestly, it should be slowed down. Its always been pretty sad that a tamer can rune hotspots and just fling his WW around making a ton of gold. Farming should not be as easy as it is currently. At least force people to go through low level crap to get to the better stuff. Might force more interactions between players too.

As much as I love the thought, it's not going to happen and would only turn away the 'I've been playing for 15 years and don't want to 'work' to build up' crowd.

Doubtful. Forcing people to run through mobs instead of instant recall is not that big of a deal. Not like they would fight them. It should be hard to farm high level stuff. Not recall when in trouble, or low on essentials. Not everyone should be rich and powerful. Not everyone should have a fortress. It cheapens the game and the server. I was quite content with my small 8x8 house for a long time.

Its not like our numbers are super high anyways. With such low numbers, we need people to come in contact with each other more. The more fun the environment is, the more people will come. Also, this game isn't about dungeons and farming. Its about player interaction. At least that is what Richard Garriott had in mind when he began his little adventure. Note the absence of real quests completely at least from OSI.

Vanqs are already overflowing. Someone was even complaining of their cheap cost. 3k was it? We shouldn't pander to the lazy people that want "easy lootz" but people that actually enjoy the interaction of playing with others. Otherwise this game is quite boring: Trammel style.

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Richard Garriott had a 'livable' world in mind where players could play as they choose within the functions of the game. Lest I remind you all of the time-honored "Ultima isn't about baking bread" story.

All this talk about changing recall/gate/what-have-you.... as though the current system in place right now ever stopped any shard from becoming overrun with gank squads. :roll:

You should be discussing ways to keep that from happening yet again, not ways to accelerate the process.

Your post would be better off adding to the discussion instead of putting down ideas. I would be most interesting in what you would propose to help the situation. Gank squads are not going to go anywhere.

The ideas put forth are a way to keep gank squads from running quick kills. Scaling kills with recall gives PKs the choice of being annoyed with excessive cast time or killing that "noob" miner. Shoot, removing recall to pks completely might even be viable. Also, removing the ability for blues to heal them could be another option on top of what has been said. That or scale kills for a percentage decrease for cross heals for every affiliation, red included.

A temp stat loss should make them less likely to run. Excessive kills should make it very hard for a PK to run from any fight. This would allow pk hunters a fair chance at killing them. A proper bounty system would be awesome too. With a temp stat loss, rezzing fellow pks keeps them from entering the battle quickly. But doesn't stop them for the whole night.

Overall, this gives the pk play style the ability to be played as a main, without worrying about having to macro off kills and the like. Its similar to factions yet has plenty of punishments for killing, all while keeping it playable. Its almost like a handicap that can scale with the players skill.

You are right, if everyone was supposed to be rich and powerful, they would ALL have access to creating Tamers.
As it is, it is completely unfair that anyone should put time and effort into leveling tamers and then having to tame some mob to fight their battles for them, then after all this, actually be able to use said mob to farm untold riches.

Lets remove that.

You don't have to be smug. Anyways, your argument holds no water. Just because you make a tamer shouldn't give you the automatic ability to farm and make a ton of gold. There should be a slight danger and it should not be as easy as gating around to all the hotspots.

Walking through dungeons and not being able to escape instantly is always a good thing. Unless you just want a shard full of gold and epics with access to everything, without the need to rely on other players. If that's the case, you are better off playing on an offline shard killing monsters by yourself.

I do not understand the hostility toward trying to work in a better/different direction. Key is, Player Killing is a huge part of this game, and it a necessary evil. There needs to be checks and balances, and unlimited farming is completely useless. If you do not want to take more than a few weeks/months to build up to something, maybe this game isn't for you.

Sadly, your post was quite useless and made no point, other than you seem to disagree with something. Please add to the discussion instead of inserting hostility and ignorance.

I think his point was fair. This game is old, and getting rich and powerful is as easy as making a tamer.

Player Killing is criminal, however relevant to the game . There's really nothing wrong with the system as is, although I would like to see a bounty board again.
Immediate recall after engaging in battle is already impossible, so there's no real reason to alter that.

Not saying to stop making suggestions or share thoughts, I just think it's fine how it is. There should be no reason to encourage player killing. It should be challenging and very risky, like murder really is.
Making money generally is not as risky. Taking your skills into the field to make some money can have variable challenges, and tamers take the highest risk. They can't just recall out, without losing some tames, so there's always that.